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Post by marekv on Jan 20, 2016 19:24:49 GMT
Big thanks to Pete Birdie.
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Post by a moderator on Jan 20, 2016 22:19:52 GMT
So instead of killing Jann with the ZED spell, you just defeat the Archmage, grab the crown, and swan off (well, Birdman off), leaving Jann in his cell to await a lingering death by starvation. Probably not much of an improvement, from his perspective.
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Post by Pete Byrdie on Jan 20, 2016 22:33:46 GMT
Well, he was annoying.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,453
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jan 21, 2016 13:39:13 GMT
Aw, I always liked Jann. Then again I also like Jar Jar Binks.
Thoughts of writing a fan adventure where Jann ends up the new Archmage of Mampang stirring in my mind...
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Post by a moderator on Jan 21, 2016 22:50:11 GMT
He might need a different title from 'Archmage', what with the whole anti-magic aura thing.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,453
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jan 22, 2016 12:43:56 GMT
Hmm, good point.
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Post by ed on Jan 2, 2018 13:52:32 GMT
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Post by johnbrawn1972 on Aug 12, 2018 19:11:27 GMT
There is something unusual about Champskees solution after buying the candles because I do not think it is possible to take the oak sapling after the incredibly generous +1 attack strength bonus for your sword.
It seems you can take this route and then the generous bonus and then go back to the doors but there is no advantage as far as I can tell.
You might guess today I am in autistic mode.
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Post by Pete on Dec 13, 2018 5:30:52 GMT
I have a question which I don't think has been discussed here. I always play by the letter of the rules, but (potential slight spoiler coming up).....
What should I do when, having cast the ZED spell without first learning its secret, and gone back to an earlier location, I try to cast a spell for which I have the required item, only to be told that I don't (because I couldn't have had it the first time around)? I can't proceed as if I have it, because there it no page to turn to, and it doesn't seem fair to take the stamina penalty (and suffer any other consequences of a failed spell).
Any suggestions?
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,453
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Dec 13, 2018 11:43:38 GMT
What should I do when, having cast the ZED spell without first learning its secret, and gone back to an earlier location, I try to cast a spell for which I have the required item, only to be told that I don't (because I couldn't have had it the first time around)? Â I can't proceed as if I have it, because there it no page to turn to, and it doesn't seem fair to take the stamina penalty (and suffer any other consequences of a failed spell). Any suggestions? Yeah, don't think Steve thought people would actually bother playing out getting sent back to earlier parts of the books so didn't bother working this stuff out. I would say maybe take it that the item was damaged during the time travel and so no longer works. This would probably mean taking the penalty though which I agree is a bit unfair.
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Post by daredevil123 on Dec 13, 2018 19:12:43 GMT
What should I do when, having cast the ZED spell without first learning its secret, and gone back to an earlier location, I try to cast a spell for which I have the required item, only to be told that I don't (because I couldn't have had it the first time around)? I can't proceed as if I have it, because there it no page to turn to, and it doesn't seem fair to take the stamina penalty (and suffer any other consequences of a failed spell). Any suggestions? Yeah, don't think Steve thought people would actually bother playing out getting sent back to earlier parts of the books so didn't bother working this stuff out. I would say maybe take it that the item was damaged during the time travel and so no longer works. This would probably mean taking the penalty though which I agree is a bit unfair. Doesn't all your equipment get lost when you travel back in time?
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Post by a moderator on Dec 13, 2018 22:41:22 GMT
Yeah, don't think Steve thought people would actually bother playing out getting sent back to earlier parts of the books so didn't bother working this stuff out. I would say maybe take it that the item was damaged during the time travel and so no longer works. This would probably mean taking the penalty though which I agree is a bit unfair. Doesn't all your equipment get lost when you travel back in time? Depends which edition you're playing. The Wizard Books reissue 'solved' the problem by adding text to every paragraph that redirects you to an earlier book, stating that you've lost all your possessions. ETA: Well, the one that sends you back to paragraph 1 of The Shamutanti Hills lets you have your starting equipment, but in the rest you have nothing, which can make for some lethal situations.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,453
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Dec 14, 2018 10:19:50 GMT
The Wizard Books reissue 'solved' the problem by adding text to every paragraph that redirects you to an earlier book, stating that you've lost all your possessions. Good old Wizard - never a problem they can't solve by introducing a completely new problem.
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Post by daredevil123 on Dec 14, 2018 19:41:21 GMT
Doesn't all your equipment get lost when you travel back in time? Depends which edition you're playing. The Wizard Books reissue 'solved' the problem by adding text to every paragraph that redirects you to an earlier book, stating that you've lost all your possessions. ETA: Well, the one that sends you back to paragraph 1 of The Shamutanti Hills lets you have your starting equipment, but in the rest you have nothing, which can make for some lethal situations. I have the Wizard editions and never knew there was a change. Which should I accept as the "correct" version then? Argh.
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Post by lordomnibok on Dec 14, 2018 23:22:13 GMT
The Wizard Books reissue 'solved' the problem by adding text to every paragraph that redirects you to an earlier book, stating that you've lost all your possessions. Good old Wizard - never a problem they can't solve by introducing a completely new problem. haha 😆
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Post by ed on Dec 15, 2018 13:40:12 GMT
I must check the Wizard editions for that.
Are your possessions not removed from you when you are imprisoned in the Archmage's tower ?
There wouldn't be much point in re-starting from an earlier book if you had lost all of your gear.
Did anyone here ever NOT cheat and accept their time lost fate ?
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Post by a moderator on Dec 15, 2018 14:47:00 GMT
Are your possessions not removed from you when you are imprisoned in the Archmage's tower ? No. Section 98 gives the option 'Use something from your pack'. Besides, it's impossible to win without using an item. Once the Netherworld Demon is dead, you can't escape from Mampang unless you have a whistle for summoning the Samaritans of Schinn or holy water to resurrect Farren Whyde. Warriors would be doomed even sooner by confiscation of all equipment, as they can't even get out of the tower without the genie in the bottle provided by the She-Satyrs. Steve Jackson could be cruel at times, but not so harsh as to intentionally make it impossible to ever win. I went all the way back to the Manticore fight from The Shamutanti Hills when I played Sorcery! in the 1980s. Then again, I'm the nut who restarted the Lone Wolf series from the very beginning after failing book 11 in the early 1990s.
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Post by Ed on Dec 15, 2018 15:42:16 GMT
Just imagine if the adventure was real and you went back in time, thinking " oh no, now I have to slog my way through all of this again ! "
But then again, you would have foreknowledge of what is to come.
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Post by johnbrawn1972 on Dec 15, 2018 17:38:28 GMT
Just imagine if the adventure was real and you went back in time, thinking " oh no, now I have to slog my way through all of this again ! " But then again, you would have foreknowledge of what is to come. Shades of Forest of Doom then? I doubt the original books really intended to suggest you should start slogging your way through all the encounters/books Groundhog Day.
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Post by Ed on Dec 17, 2018 19:13:23 GMT
Another possible side effect of time travel is amnesia or memory loss.
You may only have retained your memory up to the point where you re-start an earlier book.
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Post by a moderator on Dec 18, 2018 2:34:07 GMT
If time travel caused memory loss, you wouldn't be able to recall Jann's revelation about Farren Whyde, so you'd just get tricked into going to the tower again. The endgame of The Crown of Kings would become an inescapable loop like the Chaos Warrior/Quimmel Bone fights in Creature of Havoc.
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Post by Ed on Dec 18, 2018 19:38:58 GMT
Surely that only applies if you have full control of the ZED spell ?
If you don't, you could end up back in book 1 or 2.
Would you still have all of your memory intact ?
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Post by a moderator on Dec 19, 2018 0:18:26 GMT
But there's still a chance (the joint second most likely outcome) that casting the ZED spell without knowing its effects will take you back to just befoe you encounter Farren Whyde. If a player is lucky enough to get that outcome, should they be banned from acting on the information provided by Jann, even though the text says nothing about forgetting?
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Post by Ed on Dec 19, 2018 18:41:17 GMT
I suppose we'll just have to assume that your memory remains intact.
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Post by Wilf on Dec 29, 2018 3:35:11 GMT
The player's memory would be intact, so yes, I'd make that assumption.
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Post by dragonwarrior8 on Dec 3, 2019 0:35:10 GMT
As exceptional as I found this book to be, I did have one small irk maybe someone could help me with. Using the clue from The Time Serpent you might already know (or strongly suspect) that Farren Whyde is the Archmage. But the first time you meet him (unless Ive missed something), there is jack all you can do about it and are forced to leave for the other tower? This seems to make the Time Serpent's clue meaningless no?
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,453
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Dec 3, 2019 8:29:00 GMT
As exceptional as I found this book to be, I did have one small irk maybe someone could help me with. Using the clue from The Time Serpent you might already know (or strongly suspect) that Farren Whyde is the Archmage. But the first time you meet him (unless Ive missed something), there is jack all you can do about it and are forced to leave for the other tower? This seems to make the Time Serpent's clue meaningless no? Yeah, pretty much. It also rather spoils the surprise.
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Post by johnbrawn1972 on Dec 3, 2019 18:21:20 GMT
As exceptional as I found this book to be, I did have one small irk maybe someone could help me with. Using the clue from The Time Serpent you might already know (or strongly suspect) that Farren Whyde is the Archmage. But the first time you meet him (unless Ive missed something), there is jack all you can do about it and are forced to leave for the other tower? This seems to make the Time Serpent's clue meaningless no? Yeah, pretty much. It also rather spoils the surprise. When I saw the book in 1985 I would have been about 13 and at that age I think I was glad of the double reinforcement as to what to do.
I must admit it would be very neat if there was bonus page to turn to after the clue from The Serpent of Time to circumvent the prison tower. I had never thought about this before.
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Post by a moderator on Dec 3, 2019 22:38:02 GMT
I mentioned that bug in passing a long while back. Libra admits that Mampang looks so nasty she dare not enter it (though, conveniently, she does know about a secret door I'm only likely to need to use if, say, the book were to deny me the opportunity to use the hint I got from the Serpent of Time) It is a pain that there's no way for your character to infer the truth from that clue.
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Post by Ed on Dec 5, 2019 19:34:27 GMT
Its designed to play out that way so as not to make it too easy just as you always end up in certain areas no matter what choices you make.
And of course, the Serpent of Time ( like the rest of his winged brethren ) had assumed that you would never live to use that information.
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