Blackheart
Squire
Formerly known as Symm. Razaak raised me from the dead.
Posts: 42 
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
|
Post by Blackheart on Nov 29, 2019 7:02:32 GMT
Shame and disgrace!
The illustrations used to be an incentive to start with an adventure as soon as possible...
...and now this! After flipping through the book my only urge is to open the window!
|
|
|
|
Post by philsadler on Nov 29, 2019 8:16:39 GMT
Shame and disgrace! The illustrations used to be an incentive to start with an adventure as soon as possible... ...and now this! After flipping through the book my only urge is to open the window! I think suicide is going a bit far!
:-)
|
|
Blackheart
Squire
Formerly known as Symm. Razaak raised me from the dead.
Posts: 42
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
|
Post by Blackheart on Nov 29, 2019 8:31:52 GMT
Shame and disgrace! The illustrations used to be an incentive to start with an adventure as soon as possible... ...and now this! After flipping through the book my only urge is to open the window! I think suicide is going a bit far!
:-)
Indeed! I have been thinking about tossing the book :-)
|
|
vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
|
Post by vagsancho on Nov 30, 2019 10:52:25 GMT
Shame and disgrace! The illustrations used to be an incentive to start with an adventure as soon as possible... ...and now this! After flipping through the book my only urge is to open the window! I think suicide is going a bit far!
:-)
What the hell... After all, one have to die, one way or another... |
|
|
|
Post by a moderator on Nov 30, 2019 17:02:17 GMT
I don't think encouraging people to kill themselves is appropriate behaviour.
|
|
|
|
Post by Wilf on Nov 30, 2019 18:58:19 GMT
I don't think encouraging people to kill themselves is appropriate behaviour. Does this mean promoting latter day Ian Livingstone gamebooks is inappropriate? |
|
|
|
Post by a moderator on Dec 1, 2019 0:09:44 GMT
Has Brexit been keeping a spate of The Port of Peril-related suicides from getting reported on?
Was some bunch of cultists driven to poison themselves by the unplayability of Blood of the Zombies?
To the best of my knowledge, not even the unremitting tedium of Legend of Zagor has been directly connected with any self-inflicted fatalities (what lies beneath Ian Livingstone's patio does not count).
Perhaps the Scholastic editions should carry a health warning like cigarette packaging, but we should still be okay to discuss them here.
|
|
|
|
Post by Wilf on Dec 1, 2019 19:19:45 GMT
Think you missed my attempt at humour. You are the hero in FF books, and Ian Livingstone's are particularly deadly. I was implying that embarking on a quest designed by Livingstone was akin to suicide.
Will try to be clearer next time!
|
|
|
|
Post by thealmightymudworm on Dec 3, 2019 1:18:36 GMT
Has Brexit been keeping a spate of The Port of Peril-related suicides from getting reported on? Was some bunch of cultists driven to poison themselves by the unplayability of Blood of the Zombies? To the best of my knowledge, not even the unremitting tedium of Legend of Zagor has been directly connected with any self-inflicted fatalities (what lies beneath Ian Livingstone's patio does not count). Perhaps the Scholastic editions should carry a health warning like cigarette packaging, but we should still be okay to discuss them here. This sort of thing?  or possibly  |
|
|
|
Post by vastariner on Dec 29, 2019 23:29:34 GMT
Quite intrigued by the suggestion that you might meet Lord Azzur again. Is Ian doing his own Azzur-based Sorcery! by using his previous works as part of it? Are we going to have another inbetween work that gets you kidnapped by Carnuss?
Also, why would Sukumvit entertain Azzur, given that Azzur openly states his desire to rule Allansia? Which would include Fang?
|
|
|
|
Post by thealmightymudworm on Apr 18, 2020 16:46:57 GMT
Ian marks the release of the Hungarian version – notable for it's green spine. Pic attached for anyone who gets Twitter embeds blocked. (Btw, does anyone know what hynreck is up to these days?)  |
|
|
|
Post by Law on May 15, 2020 10:55:51 GMT
Ian marks the release of the Hungarian version – notable for it's green spine. Pic attached for anyone who gets Twitter embeds blocked. (Btw, does anyone know what hynreck is up to these days?) Gorgeous. If only we could get an English translation of such an edition... |
|
|
|
Post by The Count on Jun 6, 2020 18:23:56 GMT
Decided to have a few goes at this today.
First attempt ended very quickly due to picking up a ridiculous number of Skill and Luck penalties...
Next started off better - the island part was quite enjoyable despite the terse paragraphs and really should have been bigger with more to explore.
Once back to the mainland, it very quickly became another linear slog resulting in an equipment list that served no purpose, a constant stream of not very powerful opponents, unnecessary plugs of other books (mildly amusing given one named title hasn't been reissued yet so if you didn't know about the series and googled it, you would be a bit confused) and the most disgusting artwork in any FF with those ridiculous twin dwarfs - I was eating my lunch when I happened on it, said lunch went into the bin immediately afterwards.
I got reasonably close to the end, having missed at least one assassin and I know where that happened, though it's unlikely that I'll try to get the clean sweep any time soon.
The writing was definitely aimed towards a particular sort of child with those that fingers in noses, oozing pus, smelling of poo sections, and it seemed to be talking down to the reader throughout. If I wanted to giggle at breaking wind, I'd read something aimed at a 3 year old. One of the attractions of FF when I was young was that the books tended to be written with the assumption that the reader was intelligent...
Artwork isn't particularly exciting either, some half decent pictures if you don't look at the whole thing (Captain Crow, the dog, the dragon).
If the island section was fleshed out more, and the assassins being reduced to a handful of dangerous fights, this could have been good.
|
|
|
|
Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 4, 2020 8:04:16 GMT
The writing was definitely aimed towards a particular sort of child with those that fingers in noses, oozing pus, smelling of poo sections, and it seemed to be talking down to the reader throughout. If I wanted to giggle at breaking wind, I'd read something aimed at a 3 year old. One of the attractions of FF when I was young was that the books tended to be written with the assumption that the reader was intelligent... I hear you, brother. As a side point (and with me having no idea if my experience is typical or not), in my class at school (ages 10 to 12 or so.. and we're talking the 80s here), those who were playing and enjoying the books included children who were doing well academically as well as those not doing so well. As you said - you do not need to talk down to children. By all means calibrate the language, but let us not have bums and snot please. If the island section was fleshed out more, and the assassins being reduced to a handful of dangerous fights, this could have been good. I really did like the way that Steve Jackson handled numerous characterful dangerous opponents in The Seven Serpents. |
|
|
|
Post by tyrion on Jul 22, 2020 11:28:42 GMT
Just received my Hungarian copy of assassins. It is the same size as the puffin/first wizard books, rather than the bigger scholastic/second wizard series. Green spine and back cover, excellent front cover. Interior illustrations are a lot better, particularly throm and the two dwarfs. Rules are in the front. It's amazing that such little things can make it feel like an old school ff book.
|
|
|
|
Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 22, 2020 12:15:55 GMT
Just received my Hungarian copy of assassins. It is the same size as the puffin/first wizard books, rather than the bigger scholastic/second wizard series. Green spine and back cover, excellent front cover. Interior illustrations are a lot better, particularly throm and the two dwarfs. Rules are in the front. It's amazing that such little things can make it feel like an old school ff book. Are there online examples of this art? I mean Throm and the dwarfs? I have found examples of the berserker, the Zengian Ultra, Sukumvit and Azzur (and a few others) from Chameleon Comix's twitter page but not those you are referring to. |
|
|
|
Post by tyrion on Jul 22, 2020 16:23:27 GMT
Just received my Hungarian copy of assassins. It is the same size as the puffin/first wizard books, rather than the bigger scholastic/second wizard series. Green spine and back cover, excellent front cover. Interior illustrations are a lot better, particularly throm and the two dwarfs. Rules are in the front. It's amazing that such little things can make it feel like an old school ff book. Are there online examples of this art? I mean Throm and the dwarfs? I have found examples of the berserker, the Zengian Ultra, Sukumvit and Azzur (and a few others) from Chameleon Comix's twitter page but not those you are referring to. Not that I've seen. If I can get pictures to upload, I'll message you. |
|
|
|
Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 22, 2020 20:13:14 GMT
Not that I've seen. If I can get pictures to upload, I'll message you. Thanks, that would be good. But if you are thinking of scanning your own book, mind you don't put a crease in the spine if the book needs fully opening up.  From what you say, it seems the book is ordered and put together better (including the artwork) than the scholastic ones? Also, is the quality of the book itself, (I mean the quality of the binding, the pages etc) up to a high standard too? The Puffins were always good, but I recall Port of Peril's spine fading off soon after contact with human fingers. |
|
|
|
Post by tyrion on Jul 23, 2020 7:35:51 GMT
I've sent you a pm. The book itself seems to be around the level of quality of the wizard first series in terms of binding and paper quality - certainly better than scholastic.
|
|
|
|
Post by The Count on Nov 14, 2020 1:21:08 GMT
Recently, I tried giving this another shot and again threw the book down in disgust when I got to the same section. Rather than just bin it, I decided to give it away. Long story short, it is now in the hands of a 7 year old boy who was learning English but now cannot attend classes. Despite not understanding the book fully yet, he loves it (he has been reading it with help from family who are bilingual) and found the same illustration hilarious. So for its many faults, it has found a use as an educational tool, and possibly the gateway to a new FF fan.
I did suggest they get him Citadel of Chaos in English next as its a bit easier and more fun, and which books to avoid for now in any language (House of Hell, Creature of Havoc, Bloodbones as they are quite tricky) and to avoid permanently (Crypt, Spellbreaker, Zombies)
|
|
vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
|
Post by vagsancho on Nov 14, 2020 9:45:07 GMT
A person who advises to avoid Crypt of the Sorcerer permanently - can only be at the antipodes of my gray personality.
|
|
|
|
Post by bloodbeasthandler on Oct 23, 2021 21:00:06 GMT
Fair question. I may be missing something, but I was working under the following assumption: the player who enters the dungeon at the end of AoA is a totally different person from the player of DD. That is, the player who enters at the end of AoA is the ninja (assassin) who enters the dungeon fourth in DD. Have you got the book to hand? Go to para 145. Then choose para 25. Maybe I'm the one who made the mistake here and I ought to take back what I've said? Looks like my theory is a bit of a stretch. The counterpart to section 25 is section 276, in which you are given the chance to represent Lord Azzur in the dungeon, having bested all of his assassins. Somehow I thought there was a section somewhere between 276 and 400 in which Lord Azzur kits you out, but alas that was a figment of my imagination and no such section exists. All this time I've been crediting Livingstone with a decent twist ending, but now I'm not so sure he deserves it. There is a twist ending, it's just that the ninja assassin from FF6 is the one from para 25 Assassins of Allansia. FF6 is based upon you losing AofA... |
|
|
|
Post by peasantscribbler on Oct 23, 2021 21:23:36 GMT
I guess that's not bad. It would have been even better if, in the end, the player is transformed into one of Azzur's assassins (after battling them throughout the book) to enter the contest on his behalf. I don't think that would have been too hard to write without introducing continuity errors. As it is, winning AoA creates a new FF universe that changes how the beginning of DD plays out, so one could argue that there are really no continuity errors. My mind has just exploded.
|
|
CharlesX
Baron
Posts: 2,184
Member is Online
|
Post by CharlesX on Oct 31, 2021 21:36:56 GMT
I feel like this book is a big missed\wasted opportunity. The premise is an amazing, exciting one with the horror of the constant assassins and the haunting silver scorpion necklace. Yet it gets bogged down in the half-expected IL tropes - cursed\useless items, minimal choice, bland writing. I think the FF solution here suggested it is impossible to technically obtain and keep the poison immunity ring, and that even if you don't stick to the rules it is not the true path, which is a shame because it was one of the better items.
My sense with this book is IL tried a touch harder than with his other recent efforts. I wish IL could try a bit harder than that.
|
|
|
|
Post by stevendoig on Nov 1, 2021 19:28:56 GMT
I've still not read it, or the next one.
Got them both when they came oot as well
Is that no' awful?
|
|
|
|
Post by philsadler on Nov 1, 2021 22:36:50 GMT
Same here. Not read the last four even though I have them. Maybe we're getting too old for all this? Which is strange because I'm only 4.
|
|
|
|
Post by a moderator on Nov 1, 2021 23:33:29 GMT
Same here. Not read the last four even though I have them. Likewise. Well, I read The Port of Peril as far as the second 'gain Stamina even though there's no way for you to have lost any, and the rules explicitly forbid exceeding the Initial score' bit before bailing. That's, what, two, maybe three decisions? For me, it was because Blood of the Zombies was so enthusiasm-crushingly dire. Right now I'm slowly, painfully trudging through it for my blog, and after that (and several Fantazine minis) I'll be properly playing the first of the Scholastic-only FFs. |
|
|
|
Post by bloodbeasthandler on Nov 8, 2021 21:02:50 GMT
Same here. Not read the last four even though I have them. Maybe we're getting too old for all this? Which is strange because I'm only 4. Yeah, i know what you mean. There's a serious point to be thought about here. What's going on do you think? Are you collecting them out of habit, or simply to 'complete the set' and line them up on a bookcase? Are the recent efforts just too infantile? How do they bear up compared to the old books of the 80s and 90s? In general the books coming out the last few years are not a natural progression from the likes of Moonrunner, Legend of the Shadow Warriors or Slaves of the Abyss (and a load more), but more a regression with the same sort of faults the worst of the originals had. I don't think it's all just rose-tinted spectacles and nostalgia making me think this way. |
|
|
|
Post by terrysalt on Nov 8, 2021 21:20:10 GMT
I am 100% buying them purely to complete the set. The reviews have generally not been kind and I ordered all 4 off Amazon all the same. Because now that I know they exist, having 65/69 books would have bugged me.
|
|
CharlesX
Baron
Posts: 2,184
Member is Online
|
Post by CharlesX on Nov 8, 2021 21:38:05 GMT
It's nostalgia isn't it. The series has always been variable\hit-and-miss, and although authors such as Green and Pratchett have produced some worthy additions to the series, frankly, half of the newer books have been shamefully drossy. I look forward to the next Morris book more than the next Livingstone FF. I really think if Livingstone and others continue to treat their audience so casually, the series will effectively cancel itself, in spite of the warm feelings we have coming from it, and it doesn't deserve that.
|
|
