kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Aug 27, 2021 22:33:36 GMT
Zagor is the poster boy of the series. Abdul is some pirate who wants to prove he's the best pirate yet isn't even piratey enough to consider cheating. So Zagor wins.
The Archmage is cunning but he's not quite tricking-you-into-eating-your-own-buddies level despicable so Zharradan wins.
Abstain on Grimslade/Orghuz as never got very far in Chasms of Malice.
Mencius is a much more delightful villain than Bythos.
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Post by daredevil123 on Aug 27, 2021 22:43:48 GMT
I like Abdul the Butcher, mostly for the glamour of his name, but I have to vote for Zagor, even though his characterisation isn't great in his later appearances.
Grimslade is effortlessly superior to Orghuz - in fact, I can't think of a single reason to vote for the latter. (Am I still sore about the 55 characters who died in my attempts at Chasms of Malice? Yes.)
I abstain from the other sets.
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Post by The Count on Aug 27, 2021 23:53:20 GMT
Zagor invents his own currency
Zharradan Marr is not in Sorcery! and can clearly beat a silly little kiddie playing at dress up, which is what the supposed arch mage is...
Orghuz isn't tempted to plunder your ring
Bythos owns the abyss
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Post by philsadler on Aug 28, 2021 7:09:22 GMT
Abdul the Butcher simply because he's not the other one. He also has the same name as a wrestler.
The Archmage is one of my favourite characters ever.
Grimslade was interesting in Scorpion Swamp.
Don't know the other two.
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Post by Peter on Aug 28, 2021 7:51:28 GMT
Abdul is honourable enough to offer a contest to determine who is best, rather than just trying to "off" his main opponent. Which seems like uncharacteristic behaviour from someone called "the Butcher". So I don't even trust him to display typical pirate habits in a showdown. Meanwhile, Zagor would be a worthy foe in life-or-death cribbage, which I would find much more enjoyable. So I vote for Zagor.
The Archmage has the power to manipulate people so completely that they forget what they stand for, while Zharradan Marr has the power to alter people so completely that they forget who they are. I spent 3 years anticipating a meeting with the Archmage, reading through 4 books to finally encounter him, and although Marr was at the end of a single book, it still took me several years to finally find him. The Archmage is presented as a nasty, spindly-looking man, while Marr is ... I can't find enough to differentiate them! I can't choose!
Grimslade just seemed unpleasant to me at first, and it wasn't necessary to have anything to do with him, so I didn't. Orghuz was more frightening, and more compulsory. But, due to his mysteriousness (due to being unfamiliar in an otherwise-familiar book), Grimslade has become more legendary to me, whereas I was happy to move on from Chasms of Malice so Orghuz didn't have a chance to grow on me. For this reason, I choose Grimslade.
I haven't met Mencius yet, but Bythos was ominous and believable, and I agree with people who praise Slaves of the Abyss, so I will pick him.
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Post by tyrion on Aug 28, 2021 9:48:48 GMT
Zagor, after killing his master he retires to his holiday home, only to be killed by some random adventurer. But he's having none of that, so comes back from the dead by means of various body parts.
Marr I think just edged it over the archmage, despite both being ridiculously easy to beat if you ever get that far.
Grimslade has obviously got a cooler name, plus he is not chasms of malice.
I'm going out on a limb here and say Mencius, not on!y does he escape from his prison cell into another world, he manages to outwit his nemesis to such a degree he finally decided to just give the magehunter the means to kill him.
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Post by peasantscribbler on Aug 28, 2021 12:55:23 GMT
Zagor has a lock on this one.
I agree with those saying that the Archmage vs. Zharradan Marr is a close match-up. I'll give the edge to Marr because he doesn't need a Crown of Kings to gather allies and minions.
I think that Mencius is a deceptively tough opponent. Bythos might underestimate him, and Mencius is intelligent enough to exploit such a mistake. I think that Mencius gets the upset victory.
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Post by petch on Aug 29, 2021 21:24:27 GMT
Abdul the Butcher joins Captains Bloodaxe and Cinnabar in Davy Jones' locker as Zagor secures an easy 7-1 win. Marr comes out on top with a 4-2 victory over Mampang's Archmage. And Grimslade achieves a decisive 5-1 triumph against Orghuz.
In the final combat of the round, Bythos twice takes the lead but is pegged back by Mencius each time, with matters ending in a 3-3 tie. Bythos was a noteworthy foe, but I think I'm going to give my casting vote to Mencius - I like tyrion's reasoning, plus Mencius' manipulative presence is felt throughout Magehunter while Bythos is only revealed as the big bad of Slaves towards the end. Also, thanks to sleepyscholar I now can't read about Mencius without picturing Julian Sands...prior to that I always imagined Mencius and the Magehunter being played by John Travolta and Nicolas Cage, taking turns being goodies and baddies like in Face/Off.
Winners: Zagor, Zharradan Marr, Grimslade & Mencius
And that concludes the round!
Round 2 Eliminations: Relem, Akharis, the Lizard King, Yaztromo, the Titanium Cyborg, Horfak, Lord Mortis, Captain Cinnabar, Feior, Laskar, Rannik, Unthank, Abdul the Butcher, the Archmage, Orghuz, Bythos
Thank you to Mrs Maude Hutton of Pepperhill Village Fete for kindly allowing the use of the tombola for selecting the pairings for the round of sixteen. After the drawing of the combatants for the to-the-death gladiatorial conflicts will be the childrens' face painting, and the raffle follows at dusk. Please take your litter home with you.
Round 3 Shareella vs The Riddling Reaver Belgaroth vs Zagor The Ancient vs Balthus Dire Voivod vs Mencius Reiner Heydrich vs Lord Carnuss Myurr vs Jann the Minimite Grimslade vs Zharradan Marr Karam Gruul vs Baron Sukumvit
With only eight fixtures to get through in this round, I might as well run them four at a time - I'll slow things down again in the next round as we get towards the business end of the competition! So then, the first eight surviving contenders vying for a spot in the quarter finals are...
Shareella vs The Riddling Reaver
Belgaroth vs Zagor
The Ancient vs Balthus Dire
Voivod vs Mencius
Voting deadline is 4pm Tues 31st.
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Post by philsadler on Aug 29, 2021 22:06:42 GMT
Shareella 'cos I don't know much about the RR and the snow witch plays a mean game of rock-paper-scissors.
Belgaroth 'cos he's not the other one.
Balthus Dire because of his haircut.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Aug 29, 2021 22:32:30 GMT
The Riddling Reaver because he's just generally awesome.
I really want to vote for Big Z but will abstain due to not knowing much about (presumably) Big B.
How is the Ancient still in this? Does he even have a personality (dragonality?)? Balthus Dire for me.
And Mencius is much more fun than Voivod (who I always want to call Vovoid).
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Post by The Count on Aug 29, 2021 23:12:42 GMT
The Riddling Reaver doesn't have either a silly hat or look like a generic b movie bimbo on his covers
Zagor returns as a greater threat each time
The Ancient is a challenge to defeat, the other one lives up to his name and is a bad villain
Voivod is a threat to the entire land
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Aug 29, 2021 23:36:59 GMT
Riddling Reaver Zagor Dire Voivod
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Post by CharlesX on Aug 30, 2021 4:49:04 GMT
Riddling Reaver Zagor Dire Voivod Same.
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Post by Peter on Aug 30, 2021 8:00:14 GMT
I just encountered The Ancient for the first time the other day, and overall I was impressed - great book, except maybe the dice need to be a bit loaded to win it - but Balthus Dire is better as an enemy.
I have no reasons to change my earlier choices. So:
Shareella Zagor Balthus Dire Either of the other two
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Post by tyrion on Aug 30, 2021 18:45:21 GMT
Riddling Reaver Zagor Dire Voivod Same.
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Post by petch on Aug 31, 2021 15:24:43 GMT
The first four quarter finalists go through with relatively comfortable margins of victory: Shareella 2 The Riddling Reaver 5; Belgaroth 1 Zagor 5; The Ancient 1 Balthus Dire 6; Voivod 4 Mencius 1.
Winners: The Riddling Reaver, Zagor, Balthus Dire & Voivod
That win for Voivod there means that, rather impressively given the advanced stage of the competition, a Stephen Hand character has still yet to lose a match. Can that record stand all the way until the quarter finals, with Myurr and Karam Gruul now set to do battle? And the Charavask siblings are both still alive and kicking...can either or both survive another round?
Reiner Heydrich vs Lord Carnuss
Myurr vs Jann the Minimite
Grimslade vs Zharradan Marr
Karam Gruul vs Baron Sukumvit
Last voting deadline of the round is 4pm Thurs 2nd.
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Post by CharlesX on Aug 31, 2021 18:04:46 GMT
Lord Carnuss because he is audacious as well as brave.
Magic immunity or not, Myrr would find a way to defeat Jann in a fight, but Myrr gets minus points for being a demon. Jann is my choice.
I hate having to vote against Grimslade, but Zharradan Marr is twice the sorcerer Grimslade is.
Baron Sukumvit is more memorable than Karam Gruul, plus it'd be cool to see a Baron Sukumvit vs. Lord Carnuss fight.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Aug 31, 2021 18:08:19 GMT
Lord Carnuss for standing up to his sibling instead of getting bossed about by them.
Jann beats old toadface.
Grimslade isn't in quite the same league of villain as Zharradan Marr.
And I'll give the last to Karam Gruul for being such a despicable so-and-so.
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Post by philsadler on Aug 31, 2021 20:40:20 GMT
Reiner Heydrich because he's a cliched vampire (cloaks are so 14th century).
Jann the Minimite because he's cheeky and cute, even if he can be annoying.
Grimslade.
Baron Sukumvit for the outlandishness of his hat.
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Post by tyrion on Aug 31, 2021 20:49:18 GMT
Heydrich for being such a good old fashioned vampire he got two books. Plus his family is even more dysfunctional than the Charavasks.
Although Myurr is the coolest of demons, this has to go to Jann, who gives his life for the quest for the crown.
Marr, with his bad guy exposition at the end.
Gruul, he is properly evil rather than being a reality tv host (although it might be argued that being a reality tv host is the most evil thing in the world).
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Aug 31, 2021 21:31:30 GMT
Reiner - the only villain where you get to meet all his family before you kill him (or them) Myurr - Jann does more harm than good Marr - Grimslade is small fry in comparison Sukumvit - the Damon Killian of the FF world
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Post by peasantscribbler on Aug 31, 2021 21:40:35 GMT
Reiner Heydrich vs. Lord Carnuss is too close to call.
Myurr destroys Jann the Minimite. Not even close.
Zharradan Marr has a fairly easy victory over Grimslade.
Karam Gruul just edges out Baron Sukumvit.
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Post by The Count on Aug 31, 2021 22:42:40 GMT
Reiner Heydrich sends his coach to bring you to his castle to save you the inconvenience of having to walk
Myurr could cameo in Master of the Universe
Grimslade sends adventurers off to do his dirty work
Karam Gruul is not a worm
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Post by Peter on Sept 1, 2021 7:58:01 GMT
This time I can't go with my previous choices, as I think they all lost. Therefore it makes sense to agree with everyone else's opinions, for the reasons they give. So:
The vampire The minimite The ... Marr The baron
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Post by petch on Sept 2, 2021 15:57:03 GMT
Now those were some cracking battles! Only the Marr / Grimslade fight was especially one-sided, with a 6-2 win in Marr's favour.
Heydrich beat Carnuss 5-2 in the end, but he had to rally back from 2-0 down to do it. Jann took a 4-0 lead against Myurr, but a credible fightback from the Demon Prince nearly levelled the scores, bringing it to 4-3, but the minimite clinched a 5-3 win at close of play.
Gruul vs Sukumvit saw a lead surrendered more times than any other battle thus far. Sukumvit led three times, Gruul once, but in the final reckoning the pair tied 4-4. Now, had Carnuss won his fight against Heydrich I may have been tempted to vote for Sukumvit (like Charles X, I think it would have been kinda cool to see the brothers being drawn to fight each other, but sadly it is not to be), but since he didn't, I'm going with Gruul; he's much more of a fully realised character than the enigmatic baron. I also like the creative way you defeat Gruul at the end of the book, where you basically have to withstand his magical assault until he runs out of MP.
Winners: Reiner Heydrich, Jann the Minimite, Zharradan Marr & Karam Gruul
Round 3 Eliminations: Shareella, Belgaroth, the Ancient, Mencius, Lord Carnuss, Myurr, Grimslade, Baron Sukumvit
And so we finally reach the quarter final stage. From 64 initial competitors, only 8 remain. Those eight have been drawn against each other as follows...
Quarter Finals Balthus Dire vs Voivod Zagor vs Karam Gruul Jann the Minimite vs Reiner Heydrich The Riddling Reaver vs Zharradan Marr
The first two fixtures see the antagonists of the very first two FF books take on adversaries from the imagination of Stephen Hand. Who will come out on top between the classic villains, and the villains from the books ranked at 2 and 3 in the rankings thread?
Balthus Dire vs Voivod
Zagor vs Karam Gruul
Deadline for this one is 4pm Sat 4th.
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Post by CharlesX on Sept 2, 2021 17:47:12 GMT
Voivod is harder to defeat; the whole book is.
Zagor deserves to win.
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Post by The Count on Sept 3, 2021 7:46:36 GMT
Voivod needs you to do something counter intuitive to win, Abysmal just needs someone to pull up the blinds slightly
Zagor is inventive in his comebacks and doesn't just blast away ineffectually
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Post by tyrion on Sept 3, 2021 7:52:06 GMT
Voivod; the twist when you defeat him is great.
Zagor. The big Z.
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Post by philsadler on Sept 3, 2021 8:25:45 GMT
Balthus 'Impudent Peasant' Dire
Karam 'Not the Other One' Gruul
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Sept 3, 2021 10:29:09 GMT
Zagor and Balthus Dire for me. Gruul probably is the better character, but he's just far less important to the series. Voivod just isn't that memorable.
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