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Post by tyrion on Jul 4, 2020 13:09:10 GMT
Last round armies of death was eliminated, so now we are left with no books by Livingstone or Jackson in this round, which is slightly interesting.
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Post by stevendoig on Jul 4, 2020 13:54:14 GMT
Sticking with Fangs.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,457
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jul 4, 2020 13:54:55 GMT
Battleblade Warrior gets my vote. Not a terrible book but it's a bit underwhelming and forces your hand a bit too much.
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Jul 4, 2020 15:58:26 GMT
The playable aspect of a fighting fantasy book always was of no importance to me. Crypt of the sorcerer, city of thieves, deathtrap dungeon, caverns of the snow witch, and trial of champions are the 5 books that made of livingstone the best author of all. Caverns is epic. Deathtrap dungeon is even more. Trial of champions is even more joint with a bloody desire for veagance. But the most epic ones are city of thieves and crypt of the sorcerer. But by far Crypt has the best anthagonist.
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Post by vastariner on Jul 4, 2020 16:23:34 GMT
I went with Stealer of Souls, for the simple reason that I could not remember a blessed thing about it. So it must have been particularly by numbers.
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Post by philsadler on Jul 4, 2020 16:48:49 GMT
All I can remember from Daggers is the poison system. All I can remember from Fangs is the walls system. All I can remember from Portal is that I found it boring and that one of the enemies you fought had a skill of 3, so I'll go with Portal then.
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Post by tyrion on Jul 4, 2020 17:23:59 GMT
There are definitely some unremarkable books in this set. I replayed fangs, dagger and battleblade last month to give this group a fair chance and I still can't remember what happened in them. Compared to vault or slaves which I still remember years later.
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 4, 2020 17:39:17 GMT
All I can remember from Daggers is the poison system. All I can remember from Fangs is the walls system. All I can remember from Portal is that I found it boring and that one of the enemies you fought had a skill of 3, so I'll go with Portal then. That bit that appeared in early gamebooks stating '..any player no matter how weak on initial dice rolls, should be able to get through...' ? I think Peter Darvill-Evans took it seriously, and the solution to FF37 would appear to confirm it. A SKILL 3 opponent to a SKILL 7 player-character is the same as a SKILL 8 opponent to a SKILL 12 player-character. I do take your point though.
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Post by a moderator on Jul 4, 2020 18:26:27 GMT
That Skill 3 opponent has a special attack that can reduce your Skill before the fight starts (by more than 6 points if you roll badly), so it's not necessarily the pushover that the raw numbers suggest.
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Post by philsadler on Jul 4, 2020 18:40:15 GMT
That Skill 3 opponent has a special attack that can reduce your Skill before the fight starts (by more than 6 points if you roll badly), so it's not necessarily the pushover that the raw numbers suggest. Just read the Pit version of this and it can reduce your skill by 9!
"On a 1, 2, or 3, their victim is entangled in the tongue and must reduce their SKILL by the number rolled, however they can still attack the Stegocephalian with their weapon. On a 4 or 5, they must reduce their SKILL by the number rolled, and they cannot use their weapon so must deduct another 4 SKILL for being unarmed."
OMG! I'd forgotten all of that.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Jul 4, 2020 19:43:31 GMT
Portal of Evil is hugely underrated. People often complain that the 'boss' is lame and only appears at the end. What they don't realise is the boss is The Portal itself. And that's quite original if you think about it.
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Post by vastariner on Jul 4, 2020 20:47:08 GMT
And...what sort of portal is it? Different Hilbert space? Different part of the universe? Time-travelling? It's lustrously obscure.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Jul 4, 2020 21:16:10 GMT
And...what sort of portal is it? Different Hilbert space? Different part of the universe? Time-travelling? It's lustrously obscure. Not really. There's a nice bit of lore on the Portal if you meet the Wizard.
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Post by Wilf on Jul 4, 2020 21:22:47 GMT
That Skill 3 opponent has a special attack that can reduce your Skill before the fight starts (by more than 6 points if you roll badly), so it's not necessarily the pushover that the raw numbers suggest. Just read the Pit version of this and it can reduce your skill by 9!
"On a 1, 2, or 3, their victim is entangled in the tongue and must reduce their SKILL by the number rolled, however they can still attack the Stegocephalian with their weapon. On a 4 or 5, they must reduce their SKILL by the number rolled, and they cannot use their weapon so must deduct another 4 SKILL for being unarmed."
OMG! I'd forgotten all of that.
I seem to recall that bugger was the death of Adventuring Wilf when I played through Portal Of Evil on the old forum, many moons ago...
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Post by deadshadowrunner on Jul 5, 2020 10:33:25 GMT
Funny how Daggers has 0 votes to Fangs' 7, given how similar they are in style, at least to me (bumble around and meet a variety of interesting encounters). Not sure where the dislike for Fangs comes from to be honest.
My vote easily goes to Battleblade Warrior.
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 5, 2020 11:08:59 GMT
Funny how Daggers has 0 votes to Fangs' 7, given how similar they are in style, at least to me (bumble around and meet a variety of interesting encounters). Not sure where the dislike for Fangs comes from to be honest. Speaking only for myself (as someone who voted for F of F this round) I'll probably vote for D of D next round and for similar reasons. They just feel so random and odd sometimes. And events can go past at a colossal speed. I'll think about it and try to find you an example.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,457
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jul 5, 2020 13:40:15 GMT
Funny how Daggers has 0 votes to Fangs' 7, given how similar they are in style, at least to me (bumble around and meet a variety of interesting encounters). Not sure where the dislike for Fangs comes from to be honest. I like Fangs but I feel Daggers is better. It's a cooler concept (a deadly game to be king with a twist), it's a bit more coherent and it has a better finale with the powers. The mazes, medallions and the different tribes are fun ideas too. Finally I think the mini games are better - deadly snakes and ladders trumps looking at a picture for cubes.
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Post by Wilf on Jul 5, 2020 13:49:42 GMT
Funny how Daggers has 0 votes to Fangs' 7, given how similar they are in style, at least to me (bumble around and meet a variety of interesting encounters). Not sure where the dislike for Fangs comes from to be honest. Speaking only for myself (as someone who voted for F of F this round) I'll probably vote for D of D next round and for similar reasons. They just feel so random and odd sometimes. And events can go past at a colossal speed. Yep, me too.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Jul 5, 2020 13:52:14 GMT
Fang of Fury doesn't have as many interesting encounters as Daggers does. It isn't bad but can be somewhat boring at times whereas Daggers of Darkness may feel very random but it's fun at the same time.
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Jul 5, 2020 16:31:19 GMT
Even with the imense flaws of Chasms of Malice, i would still say that it is luke sharps best book... Chasms has an energy inside it... A dark energy that none of his other books have.
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 5, 2020 18:40:32 GMT
There are things to praise in Luke Sharp's books - sub games, replayability, codes or hidden things to look for, and i do not doubt he has a good imagination.
I just don't like the overall techniques, style and lack of description .... and it applies to all his books.
Some examples I found just flicking through Daggers of Darkness.
Paras 189 then 204. Are they not at at breakneck speed? So little description of the boat, the sailors or anything. There's an attack by dragons, you man the ballista, have a random roll taking a potshot at one of them (probably miss), you get burned, shipwrecked and swim to the coast. All in 2 paras! look at para 14 which may or may not have preceded the above...
Entire regions, cities and journeys, as well as allies come and go (and are usually only very cursorily described) in a single paragraph or two. Random death or success rolls abound (one strike combat being the worst) and choices are random, so much so that they may as well be a flip of a coin.
Left or right? Up or down? Backwards or forwards? The hill or the valley? The orc or the goblin? The black or the white?
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,457
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jul 5, 2020 19:06:00 GMT
There are things to praise in Luke Sharp's books - sub games, replayability, codes or hidden things to look for, and i do not doubt he has a good imagination. I just don't like the overall techniques, style and lack of description .... and it applies to all his books. Some examples I found just flicking through Daggers of Darkness. Paras 189 then 204. Are they not at at breakneck speed? So little description of the boat, the sailors or anything. There's an attack by dragons, you man the ballista, have a random roll taking a potshot at one of them (probably miss), you get burned, shipwrecked and swim to the coast. All in 2 paras! look at para 14 which may or may not have preceded the above... Entire regions, cities and journeys, as well as allies come and go (and are usually only very cursorily described) in a single paragraph or two. Random death or success rolls abound (one strike combat being the worst) and choices are random, so much so that they may as well be a flip of a coin. Left or right? Up or down? Backwards or forwards? The hill or the valley? The orc or the goblin? The black or the white? Pretty fair assessment though his brevity does mean his books are unparalleled when it comes to variety. I think Star Strider is his least bad book when it comes to brevity. It still has some rushed sequences but quite a few are given space to breathe. Another reason I consider it underrated!
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Jul 5, 2020 19:22:09 GMT
Even with the irritating flaws, the multiple and big irritating flaws... Chasms of malice is way... Way better that daggers of darkness or star strider (awfull book). Daggers and star strider has no... No magic at all. Chasms... With the 7 khuddams... And orghuz... The brother that become bad... Has some strange magic in it... Way better.
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Jul 5, 2020 19:26:29 GMT
Life is a dream after all... And what is a dream without magic... You dream a dream without magic... And you will know you're awake.
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Post by vastariner on Jul 5, 2020 21:13:52 GMT
And...what sort of portal is it? Different Hilbert space? Different part of the universe? Time-travelling? It's lustrously obscure. Not really. There's a nice bit of lore on the Portal if you meet the Wizard. What does he say? I can't remember now and PoE is not easy to access right now...
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 5, 2020 21:55:29 GMT
Not really. There's a nice bit of lore on the Portal if you meet the Wizard. What does he say? I can't remember now and PoE is not easy to access right now... The danger we face is greater than anyone can imagine. This evil has arisen before – many thousands of years ago , when only the Goblins lived for hundreds of miles around. Underground, a source of evil was discovered: a gateway to another place, a forgotten, ancient world of giant and unnatural beasts. The Portal had, perhaps, existed since time began, allowing a few wandering animals and humanoids to pass through. The evil in the portal was quiescent, waiting – and one day a Goblin war-chief proud and powerful, found the Portal, entered it, and was held fast by the evil force. The war-chief and the Portal took strength from each other and together they enslaved the population, creating an army of merciless thralls. Each wore a stone like the talisman you have shown me. But the Goblin war-chief was defeated! There are clues to help us. The Goblin war-chief made his base on the other side of the Portal, in the forgotten land. He thought he was safe there, believing that anyone from his world who passed beneath the Portal would be enslaved or, if his will was too strong for slavery, would be transformed into an animal or, in the last resort, simply exterminated by the power of the Portal. But the Goblins found a hero: one of their own race who was brave and strong and who, by chance, found the means to pass safely through the Portal. He took with him to animals – and many flaming torches, for the Portal was deep underground. And it seems that, after the Portal was unable to enslave him, it could not change him into an animal either, because he had two other creatures with him, and this dissipated the Portal’s power; nor could it destroy him because he was surrounded by light. Once through the Portal, the hero found the war-chief and slew him; returning though the Portal, he ordered that it be sealed below ground for ever. I would guess that the recent mine-workings have undone the concealment that the Goblins undertook all those thousands of years ago. Another great evil-doer has found the Portal; another warlord has arisen. But at least we have some clues about how to find and destroy him. Now we must depart!
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Post by thealmightymudworm on Jul 5, 2020 22:10:28 GMT
Not really. There's a nice bit of lore on the Portal if you meet the Wizard. What does he say? I can't remember now and PoE is not easy to access right now... This is one relevant paragraph: Edit: Ha! Beaten to it.
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Post by thealmightymudworm on Jul 5, 2020 22:38:03 GMT
I own four of these books: BW, FoF, PoE and VotV. BW and FoF (currently tied including my vote) are probably the weakest of those four but not equally imo.
FoF feels far more original, particularly with ideas tied to mechanics. The semaphore-style code, the name of the religion in puzzles, the timebomb bracelet and the white cubes in the illustrations are all fun, engaging ideas. In general I like the quest – carrying a little torch to reignite a great flame Olympics-style and so unleash magical stone dragons – as much more inspiring than the 'find a sword and two gems' mission of BW. I like the concept of black cubes too for some reason.
Perhaps the writing and/or gameplay holds it back from being a great book, but there's surely enough there to favour it over the more by-the-numbers BW. Especially as that has its own gameplay issues relating to food and railroading.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Jul 5, 2020 23:38:02 GMT
The time-bomb bracelet is an illusion and it certainly feels that way when you read it. Do this thing quickly or you and everyone will die. YOU: Nope! I wanna save this random school kid, and play Elf games first.
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Post by The Count on Jul 6, 2020 1:24:42 GMT
Battleblade Warrior is still here?
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