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Post by hynreck on Dec 10, 2013 16:13:18 GMT
Alright, this is still from the good salvage work done by Mudworm. As Mudworm's been pointing out to me recently, what's left from all those salvages is starting to grow thin, with only bits and fragments of conversations, reviews and oddities. Case in point: this review of mine is certainly missing a huge chunk of it. I can't quite remember how big it used to be, and I've been repeating myself on this for a while now, but it's becoming clearer and clearer as we approach the final few books.
If I remember correctly, and I believe I do, my shortest review was for the first book of all, Warlock of Firetop Mountain, and I assure you it was bigger than this. And as time passed, my reviews grew longer, due to more ramblings, no doubt, but still! There might have been a few exceptions to this rule, but not many. So what does that mean in this case? Unfortunately, it has been a while since I've read those FF, and my memory is now hazy and I can't garantee I'll found anything worthwhile to say about this book to fill in the blanks. I'll do my best for now, but I'm guessing that, until the day that I play this book proper, as I intend to do, there shan't be a new review with fresh perspective from me for awhile. (and just to put you in perspective, I won't be replaying any of my old FF before I play most likely all of those: Golden Dragon gamebooks, Demonspawn, Cretan Chronicles, Grail Quest (those I have), Virtual Reality, Lone Wolf, Fabled Lands, Destiny Quest, some other odd ones, er, yeah. See? Now you know)
Alright, after a short break (break from where? Limbo?), I'm back at reviewing, this time one of the longest title out there! dum dum dum... (<-- Yes, this bit was saved from virtual limbo, nothing else, I'm sure, from all the other really good insightful stuff that I probably wrote about this particular book, sigh) This is another new book for me, one I remember seeing in my youth but never got around to own, even less play.
From afar, cover looks great but doesn't hold up so well to close scrutiny; Lord Mortis seems to be towering above an army of Smurfs skeletons about to take over some sort of Lego-esque construction (at least that's still funny. Look at it again, I know I'm not the only one pointing that out). Again, David Gallagher seems to have funky views about proportions, or maybe it's just the cartoonish approach, observed in the inside illos aplenty, that grates me the wrong way just a little too much. Seems to me that material of such a dark topic; plenty of undead, having to test your resolve constantly out of fear; would deserve an artist that does the undead more justice, someone like Russ Nicholson or Martin McKenna (and now I know that Dave Morris is a big fan of Russ Nicholson, so I think he would agree).
Insert giant missing chunk of the review here, talking about story elements and gameplay (see, obviously it's missing a big chunk as there is no way I would have only talk about the art and skip to the conclusion).
So, what do I remember from this book? Well, since I never played it proper I probably should skip gameplay review, as I'm not the most fitted for this, but at the same time it's not like I didn't play it at all and only read the text; I did follow some rules, like never pretend I own an item when that wasn't the case, choose randomly when asked to do so, etc. Mostly I just skipped battles and used save states, if you will.
I remember this book being relatively easy, considering, and from what I remember from reading other people's playthrough on the net, it is usually seen as rather easy indeed. Now, people have also stated that it is quite short, as you can go straight to the bad guy and still have a decent shot at winning, and while I'm not debating this fact, I also remember taking the long way around, visiting locations whenever available, trying to make the most of my sojourn in Lich-Lord land. So, from my perspective, the book certainly wasn't short, and offered a good variety of scenarios that were interesting with varying degrees of difficulty.
Ok, so I guess the above will have to cover story for now too, as I can't go into details without being either redundant or going into small details that are overall insignificant to this review. Such as it is, I can only remember flashes of specific scenes in the story or overall impressions, and since I'm already being redundant right now, I'll leave with that long ago conclusion...
(here it is, brace yourself, it's a good one!) I was not wowed by it's originality, but was not disappointed either by anything too tedium. It was entertaining, and in the end, that's really the most important thing for me.
Wow, great piece of work here my friend. At least now it's preserve for eternity right? wink wink ...at least I can have a laugh at myself! |
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Post by a moderator on May 24, 2014 12:34:25 GMT
More salvage:
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Post by Peter on Feb 15, 2020 8:15:46 GMT
I've just finished this - what a great book! When I compare it to something like Deathtrap Dungeon or Scorpion Swamp, it shows the variety of stories/adventures possible within the same familiar setting (Allansia).
As people have said, you don't need multiple attempts to find the way to a successful ending (there's no "one true path" to find), and you can skip vast sections and make it quite a short book. But it is a brilliant story and it was a pleasure to read.
There is one point of contention though. When you (SPOILER ALERT) do the thing at the tall pointy thing, you get divinely favoured with stat boosts. Now, I always try to play by the letter of the rules, extracting any advantage I can, so I'm tempted in my interpretation of this one. How would you define this instruction:
"Add 3 to your initial and current Luck, 1 to your Skill and 4 to your Stamina".
Does this mean your initial and current luck, skill and stamina are all increased, or do you just get the luck bonus along with skill and stamina being restored? The first option would seem to fit the story better, considering what you need to do to get to this point, and it is difficult to lose a skill point before this. But the second option seems to be a slightly more grammatically-correct interpretation. But the first one isn't incorrect, strictly speaking, so I would take it and walk away.
Am I being greedy, or am I simply exploiting an available opportunity?
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809 
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Feb 15, 2020 10:06:10 GMT
I've just finished this - what a great book! When I compare it to something like Deathtrap Dungeon or Scorpion Swamp, it shows the variety of stories/adventures possible within the same familiar setting (Allansia). As people have said, you don't need multiple attempts to find the way to a successful ending (there's no "one true path" to find), and you can skip vast sections and make it quite a short book. But it is a brilliant story and it was a pleasure to read. There is one point of contention though. When you (SPOILER ALERT) do the thing at the tall pointy thing, you get divinely favoured with stat boosts. Now, I always try to play by the letter of the rules, extracting any advantage I can, so I'm tempted in my interpretation of this one. How would you define this instruction: "Add 3 to your initial and current Luck, 1 to your Skill and 4 to your Stamina". Does this mean your initial and current luck, skill and stamina are all increased, or do you just get the luck bonus along with skill and stamina being restored? The first option would seem to fit the story better, considering what you need to do to get to this point, and it is difficult to lose a skill point before this. But the second option seems to be a slightly more grammatically-correct interpretation. But the first one isn't incorrect, strictly speaking, so I would take it and walk away. Am I being greedy, or am I simply exploiting an available opportunity? Ow... How i miss the green books... |
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,449
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Feb 15, 2020 20:12:33 GMT
I've just finished this - what a great book! When I compare it to something like Deathtrap Dungeon or Scorpion Swamp, it shows the variety of stories/adventures possible within the same familiar setting (Allansia). As people have said, you don't need multiple attempts to find the way to a successful ending (there's no "one true path" to find), and you can skip vast sections and make it quite a short book. But it is a brilliant story and it was a pleasure to read. There is one point of contention though. When you (SPOILER ALERT) do the thing at the tall pointy thing, you get divinely favoured with stat boosts. Now, I always try to play by the letter of the rules, extracting any advantage I can, so I'm tempted in my interpretation of this one. How would you define this instruction: "Add 3 to your initial and current Luck, 1 to your Skill and 4 to your Stamina". Does this mean your initial and current luck, skill and stamina are all increased, or do you just get the luck bonus along with skill and stamina being restored? The first option would seem to fit the story better, considering what you need to do to get to this point, and it is difficult to lose a skill point before this. But the second option seems to be a slightly more grammatically-correct interpretation. But the first one isn't incorrect, strictly speaking, so I would take it and walk away. Am I being greedy, or am I simply exploiting an available opportunity? I think it does mean a boost to your Initial stats too but it is very badly worded. |
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Post by cyranotheswordfish on May 31, 2020 16:17:38 GMT
Ok, having not really read any FF for a while, I'm giving the books another go and writing reviews as I do. I will be playing through them in a random order to keep things a bit more fresh for myself and will be reviewing each entry as a book (i.e the quality of it's writing) and as a game (how fun and fair it is to actually play). I wll try to avoid unecessary spoilers, but if I feel that I need to give away a piece of information in order better make a point, I will do so, so watch out if you want to remain unspoiled.
Inevitably, there will be some books which I cannot reasonably complete, but I'll generally have a fair crack and once I've decided enough is enough, I will have a 'free read' of them so that my review can be as informed as possible (I have read all of the main releases before, but my memory is hazy on a lot of them).
So without further ado, the random number generator has started me on FF #043 - The Keep of the Lich Lord:
The Book
The Keep of the Lich Lord is a well-written book, no doubt about it. The plot is not original – essentially, it’s just a case of kill-the-baddie story, who in this case has an army of undead at his disposal (he is undead himself, having returned from the grave to reclaim his dominion of 200 years past. However, a nice touch that sets it at least superficially apart from a lot of other Fighting Fantasy books is that you are not a random adventurer who happens to find themselves suddenly become a hero embroiled in an epic high-stakes quest, but a mercenary who has been contracted to kill Lord Mortis as a pre-emptive strike against any full-scale military conflict and are essentially in it for the money. It may not be a noble motive (although the mission in question certainly is), but it’s a nice change from being an out-and-out hero
The writing in TKotLL strikes an effective balance to being detailed and descriptive enough to create a convincing sense of atmosphere and environment without going overboard and impairing the flow of the book by fleshing out each of it’s references too much. The structure of the book is essentially a series of optional side-quests en route to Bloodrise Keep, where Lord Mortis resides and it is testament to how well written this book is that you fell motivated to explore as many of these options as you can even once (see The Game selection below) you realise that doing so is overkill from a gameplay perspective. Whilst, as with the main plot, none of these diversions score highly in terms of originality, they are varied in terms of situation and of how the player navigates through them and this, combined with the quality of writing, makes completionism a joy rather than a chore. On the flip-side, however, if you did decide to skip all of the diversions on offer and make a bee-line for Bloodrise Keep, the adventure can feel rather perfunctory.
Along the way, you will have the chance to meet a few secondary characters, although your level of interaction with them can vary a lot depending on choices you make. Whilst, like the majority of FF adventures, most of your journey is spent alone, the encounters with others are well-handled in that you generally get at least some sense of depth and personality despite the lack of an extended time-frame in which to really get to know them. Without wishing to give too much away for those who haven’t read the book, I did get a fair amount of satisfaction from concluding my second encounter with a particular character, which by definition means the authors did a good job with them.
Lord Mortis, however, is a disappointing exception to the above. His backstory is limited but functional enough, but the final encounter with him (of which there are two possibilities, although they differ only in narrative and not in gameplay) doesn’t feel like a final showdown, or even a particular notable confrontation at all. This is partly due to the overall slightly underwhelming nature of the final section in general. There are some interesting and intimidating encounters in Bloodrise Keep and I do appreciate it’s multiple-path design, but it does mean that it’s actually quite easy to suddenly end up facing Mortis without any sense of building to a climax, although it does also add a certain amount of replayability for those who enjoy exploring, which as alluded to above, will be a majority of players – I will finish by re-iterating what I said at the start: this is a well written book.
The Game
Whilst a lot of Fighting Fantasy gamebooks are known (or are infamous, really) for their extreme, often unfair, levels of difficulty, The Keep of the Lich Lord is actually renowned for the ease with it can be completed. As mention in the previous section, your journey to Bloodrise Keep in punctuated by a series of optional diversions which ostensibly offer the chance to make the final stage of your quest easier if you are willing to deal with the risks presented by each of these sidequests.
There are two problems with this, however. The first is that, on the whole, the book throws a few too many powerful bonuses at you for completing these side-missions, in some cases to a level disproportionate to the difficulty involved (although the graveyard in particular is quite dangerous if not approached with the correct choices). For example, you first diversion gives you the opportunity to get your sword sharpened, making all future battles much easier and ultimately rewards you with another item which makes some combats even easier still and gives you the chance to insta-kill Mortis when you reach him. This would be justifiable obtaining these items was difficult in itself, but you have to overcome only one average opponent and one downright weak one to do so.
Even with the help you are able to find throughout the book, there are not a great number of tough combats for them to be in any way essential anyway. Every reasonably dangerous fight in the book is either on a totally optional path (and in some cases, only then if you are unlucky) or can be circumvented without much difficulty. In theory, I would consider this to be good gamebook design, but the ease with which you can avoid combats, or just make them easier, tips the balance so as to detract from the sense of prevailing in a challenging mission. The final battle with Mortis in particular suffers from this: if you’ve headed straight to Bloodrise Keep and taken the quick route through, then he will prove a tough opponent, but without a lot of effort you can easily arrive at him with one (or both!) or two means with which you can instantly vanquish him (although admittedly one is not guaranteed to work, depending on your stats).
I will finally turn my attention to the extra mechanics used by this book, Resolve and Alarm Value. Additional mechanics featured in various FF books often end up being something of an irrelevance and unfortunately the same is true here. Resolve measures your ability to keep your head when encountering undead or other frightening opponents and situations, which is logical enough and the consequences of failing a test of your Resolve a generally reasonable given the context. You lose a point of Resolve upon a failing a test, which also makes sense, representing your resilience being worn down as you fail to cope in specific situations, however, the reverse is also true: you gain a point of resolver each time you pass a test. Whilst this too makes sense from a purely logical point of view (you essentially become desensitised to the horrors you face), from a gameplay perspective it means that, unless you are quite unlucky with your dice-rolls, tests of your Resolve can quickly become a formality and the mechanic is rendered totally inconsequential.
Alarm Value too has a completely reasonable function in theory – it comes in to play upon entering Bloodrise Keep represents how aware Mortis and his hordes of undead are of your movements. However, unless you really mess up, it’s very tough to increase your Alarm Value to the point of it making a difference (and there aren’t many places in which it even might), so again, outside of an unlucky first playthrough or two, it becomes an irrelevance. Perhaps The Keep of the Lich Lord’s gameplay could be summed up as a lot of good ideas implemented in too generous a context to really make a difference. I will say, however, that I would prefer a gamebook to be too easy than brokenly difficult like so many of them are.
Overall, The Keep of the Lich Lord is well worth a read, although actually playing it may leave you feeling a little unsatisfied.
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Post by stevendoig on May 31, 2020 20:36:28 GMT
Brilliant review! Looking forward to more.  |
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Post by philsadler on Jun 1, 2020 16:45:47 GMT
Ah, TKOTLL, the only FF book I completed on my first attempt ... and probably the last time that will ever happen.
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Post by tyrion on Jun 1, 2020 17:43:23 GMT
Also one of the very few books not by 'standard' authors to be republished, albeit as a fabled lands adventure. Well worth picking up, it has an introduction (to the book, not the adventure) by the author as well as some of his other ideas for gamebooks.
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Post by cyranotheswordfish on Jun 1, 2020 19:21:19 GMT
Brilliant review! Looking forward to more. Thanks! I'd actually played a few books over the last week or before deciding that reviewing them might be fun, so will hopefully have at least a couple more up soon |
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Post by The Count on Jun 1, 2020 21:45:50 GMT
This was always one of my favourites, however it has gone down in my estimations since realising you can pretty much walk straight up to the final confrontation - and win - without much effort, and getting to the best ending doesn't really make sense. Most irritating was discovering that the spear is irrelevant! At least in the likes of Crypt, Creature, Tower etc the special magic weapon is the key to victory, making it worth looking for.
The shameless plugs are not amusing either, and quite irritating now they can be easily identified for what they are.
Play with minimum stats however, and go on 2 or 3 of the side quests and it is worth playing as it is atmospheric, challenging (with Skill 7 or 8) and well written until the last half dozen sections and the occasional forced stupidity (the inn and using the ring). The graveyard is tense if you dnd up choosing the wrong place to explore,and the gibbet is one of my favourite FF encounter set pieces ever.
The map is just beautifully excecuted as well - really draws you into the book.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,449
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jun 2, 2020 18:34:16 GMT
Ok, having not really read any FF for a while, I'm giving the books another go and writing reviews as I do. I will be playing through them in a random order to keep things a bit more fresh for myself and will be reviewing each entry as a book (i.e the quality of it's writing) and as a game (how fun and fair it is to actually play). I wll try to avoid unecessary spoilers, but if I feel that I need to give away a piece of information in order better make a point, I will do so, so watch out if you want to remain unspoiled. Inevitably, there will be some books which I cannot reasonably complete, but I'll generally have a fair crack and once I've decided enough is enough, I will have a 'free read' of them so that my review can be as informed as possible (I have read all of the main releases before, but my memory is hazy on a lot of them). So without further ado, the random number generator has started me on FF #043 - The Keep of the Lich Lord: The Book The Keep of the Lich Lord is a well-written book, no doubt about it. The plot is not original – essentially, it’s just a case of kill-the-baddie story, who in this case has an army of undead at his disposal (he is undead himself, having returned from the grave to reclaim his dominion of 200 years past. However, a nice touch that sets it at least superficially apart from a lot of other Fighting Fantasy books is that you are not a random adventurer who happens to find themselves suddenly become a hero embroiled in an epic high-stakes quest, but a mercenary who has been contracted to kill Lord Mortis as a pre-emptive strike against any full-scale military conflict and are essentially in it for the money. It may not be a noble motive (although the mission in question certainly is), but it’s a nice change from being an out-and-out hero The writing in TKotLL strikes an effective balance to being detailed and descriptive enough to create a convincing sense of atmosphere and environment without going overboard and impairing the flow of the book by fleshing out each of it’s references too much. The structure of the book is essentially a series of optional side-quests en route to Bloodrise Keep, where Lord Mortis resides and it is testament to how well written this book is that you fell motivated to explore as many of these options as you can even once (see The Game selection below) you realise that doing so is overkill from a gameplay perspective. Whilst, as with the main plot, none of these diversions score highly in terms of originality, they are varied in terms of situation and of how the player navigates through them and this, combined with the quality of writing, makes completionism a joy rather than a chore. On the flip-side, however, if you did decide to skip all of the diversions on offer and make a bee-line for Bloodrise Keep, the adventure can feel rather perfunctory. Along the way, you will have the chance to meet a few secondary characters, although your level of interaction with them can vary a lot depending on choices you make. Whilst, like the majority of FF adventures, most of your journey is spent alone, the encounters with others are well-handled in that you generally get at least some sense of depth and personality despite the lack of an extended time-frame in which to really get to know them. Without wishing to give too much away for those who haven’t read the book, I did get a fair amount of satisfaction from concluding my second encounter with a particular character, which by definition means the authors did a good job with them. Lord Mortis, however, is a disappointing exception to the above. His backstory is limited but functional enough, but the final encounter with him (of which there are two possibilities, although they differ only in narrative and not in gameplay) doesn’t feel like a final showdown, or even a particular notable confrontation at all. This is partly due to the overall slightly underwhelming nature of the final section in general. There are some interesting and intimidating encounters in Bloodrise Keep and I do appreciate it’s multiple-path design, but it does mean that it’s actually quite easy to suddenly end up facing Mortis without any sense of building to a climax, although it does also add a certain amount of replayability for those who enjoy exploring, which as alluded to above, will be a majority of players – I will finish by re-iterating what I said at the start: this is a well written book. The Game Whilst a lot of Fighting Fantasy gamebooks are known (or are infamous, really) for their extreme, often unfair, levels of difficulty, The Keep of the Lich Lord is actually renowned for the ease with it can be completed. As mention in the previous section, your journey to Bloodrise Keep in punctuated by a series of optional diversions which ostensibly offer the chance to make the final stage of your quest easier if you are willing to deal with the risks presented by each of these sidequests. There are two problems with this, however. The first is that, on the whole, the book throws a few too many powerful bonuses at you for completing these side-missions, in some cases to a level disproportionate to the difficulty involved (although the graveyard in particular is quite dangerous if not approached with the correct choices). For example, you first diversion gives you the opportunity to get your sword sharpened, making all future battles much easier and ultimately rewards you with another item which makes some combats even easier still and gives you the chance to insta-kill Mortis when you reach him. This would be justifiable obtaining these items was difficult in itself, but you have to overcome only one average opponent and one downright weak one to do so. Even with the help you are able to find throughout the book, there are not a great number of tough combats for them to be in any way essential anyway. Every reasonably dangerous fight in the book is either on a totally optional path (and in some cases, only then if you are unlucky) or can be circumvented without much difficulty. In theory, I would consider this to be good gamebook design, but the ease with which you can avoid combats, or just make them easier, tips the balance so as to detract from the sense of prevailing in a challenging mission. The final battle with Mortis in particular suffers from this: if you’ve headed straight to Bloodrise Keep and taken the quick route through, then he will prove a tough opponent, but without a lot of effort you can easily arrive at him with one (or both!) or two means with which you can instantly vanquish him (although admittedly one is not guaranteed to work, depending on your stats). I will finally turn my attention to the extra mechanics used by this book, Resolve and Alarm Value. Additional mechanics featured in various FF books often end up being something of an irrelevance and unfortunately the same is true here. Resolve measures your ability to keep your head when encountering undead or other frightening opponents and situations, which is logical enough and the consequences of failing a test of your Resolve a generally reasonable given the context. You lose a point of Resolve upon a failing a test, which also makes sense, representing your resilience being worn down as you fail to cope in specific situations, however, the reverse is also true: you gain a point of resolver each time you pass a test. Whilst this too makes sense from a purely logical point of view (you essentially become desensitised to the horrors you face), from a gameplay perspective it means that, unless you are quite unlucky with your dice-rolls, tests of your Resolve can quickly become a formality and the mechanic is rendered totally inconsequential. Alarm Value too has a completely reasonable function in theory – it comes in to play upon entering Bloodrise Keep represents how aware Mortis and his hordes of undead are of your movements. However, unless you really mess up, it’s very tough to increase your Alarm Value to the point of it making a difference (and there aren’t many places in which it even might), so again, outside of an unlucky first playthrough or two, it becomes an irrelevance. Perhaps The Keep of the Lich Lord’s gameplay could be summed up as a lot of good ideas implemented in too generous a context to really make a difference. I will say, however, that I would prefer a gamebook to be too easy than brokenly difficult like so many of them are. Overall, The Keep of the Lich Lord is well worth a read, although actually playing it may leave you feeling a little unsatisfied. Pretty much a perfect review of this book! Hope you do more |
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Post by cyranotheswordfish on Jun 5, 2020 20:25:57 GMT
Thanks for the kind words! I've been doing a write-up for Sword of the Samurai which I'll hopefully upload tomorrow
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,677
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Aug 3, 2020 22:36:41 GMT
Keep of the Lich-Lord is an interesting book (not great, not terrible) that could really benefit with a few simple tweaks to balance the challenge level such as:
- Upping Mortis' Skill to 12 (or 13 if he is charged with power) so that you have a reason to do side quests.
- The Charm reducing his Stamina by half rather than killing him outright.
- Add 3 to the Skill Test if you decide to throw the Spear at Mortis to make you think twice about going for an easy victory and you don't even have the option to throw it if your Alarm Value is above 0. This makes getting the Ring of Fays more important.
- Lower the Golem's Stamina by 4. A weak hero will need to benefit from its defeat, while a strong hero can avoid the detour altogether.
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Post by a moderator on Aug 3, 2020 23:20:57 GMT
Also, the Charm should have some effect if used at section 48.
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Post by thealmightymudworm on Aug 4, 2020 2:05:13 GMT
Definitely agree with tweaks to motivate the side-quests.
I've always thought that, in particular, killing (or re-killing) Lady Lotmora should have a direct link to defeating Mortis. Eg that he would leave some item that would make him vulnerable in her safekeeping, and/or maybe that Mortis has a magical counter to the Charm if you haven't killed her.
Btw it's a bit odd that if you face her at full strength (which obviously you don't have to, but still) she has a higher SKILL than he does even though he's the big bad.
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Post by Sunil on May 22, 2021 14:08:02 GMT
I think there's a big continuity error regarding the Background. You are told you start off at Port "Vernale", but in 400 you are told you receive a hero's welcome in "Port Kanthos". Unless I'm missing something.
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Post by Sunil on May 25, 2021 21:21:58 GMT
In the background, it says you start off at a place called "Port Vernale", but in 400, you supposedly get a hero's welcome in "Port Kanthos".
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Post by a moderator on May 25, 2021 23:42:09 GMT
Comments that don't relate to the solutions belong in the dedicated threads on the books, NOT the solution threads.
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Post by Sunil on Jun 1, 2021 16:04:57 GMT
Comments that don't relate to the solutions belong in the dedicated threads on the books, NOT the solution threads. Regarding "Port Kanthos" - I haven't missed anything, have I? |
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Post by The Editor (Alex B) on Jun 5, 2021 8:06:08 GMT
Comments that don't relate to the solutions belong in the dedicated threads on the books, NOT the solution threads. Regarding "Port Kanthos" - I haven't missed anything, have I? Read the Fact of Fiction article in the next issue for my thoughts! |
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Post by Charles X. on Jul 17, 2021 5:30:43 GMT
This might sound like heresy, but I don't think Dave Morris is the best writer, gamebook or otherwise. His tone is shallow and cheap. More to the point, his gameplay mechanics and writing style are aimed at an easy level, for the younger.
I prefer Keith Martin, even Andrew Chapman, or from CYOA, Edward Packard.
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Post by Peter on Jul 17, 2021 9:42:51 GMT
Not heresy, as you are justifying your opinion with valid reasoning. Just not a common opinion.
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jul 17, 2021 10:08:15 GMT
This might sound like heresy, but I don't think Dave Morris is the best writer, gamebook or otherwise. His tone is shallow and cheap. More to the point, his gameplay mechanics and writing style are aimed at an easy level, for the younger. I prefer Keith Martin, even Andrew Chapman, or from CYOA, Edward Packard. I know it doesn't take much to confuse me, but over on the Golden Dragon thread I saw this:
My favourite gamebook series. Imo this competitor to Fighting Fantasy often surpasses the original. The writing is pretty atmospheric, the difficulty level is hard but not impossible (take note, Ian Livingstone and Joe Dever!), the system is interesting and works. I think the biggest flaw is they 'quit while they were ahead' with so few books in the series. Dave Morris wrote or co-wrote 4 out of 6 of the GD books. Is there a contradiction here? |
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Post by Charles X. on Jul 17, 2021 10:57:53 GMT
This might sound like heresy, but I don't think Dave Morris is the best writer, gamebook or otherwise. His tone is shallow and cheap. More to the point, his gameplay mechanics and writing style are aimed at an easy level, for the younger. I prefer Keith Martin, even Andrew Chapman, or from CYOA, Edward Packard. I know it doesn't take much to confuse me, but over on the Golden Dragon thread I saw this:
My favourite gamebook series. Imo this competitor to Fighting Fantasy often surpasses the original. The writing is pretty atmospheric, the difficulty level is hard but not impossible (take note, Ian Livingstone and Joe Dever!), the system is interesting and works. I think the biggest flaw is they 'quit while they were ahead' with so few books in the series. Dave Morris wrote or co-wrote 4 out of 6 of the GD books. Is there a contradiction here? Ah, good reasoning! My argument (I think) is Dave Morris can write gamebooks which are too easy; Ian Livingstone and Joe Dever can write gamebooks which are too hard. I like all three writers, I just don't think the world of any of them. One of my other favourite gamebook series is Fabled Lands, which Dave Morris often wrote, I'm just not above criticising him. In some ways, the criticism is a tribute to his big he is in the gamebook universe (and his equally intimidating Oxford degree). I believe Dave Morris wrote his very first gamebook for Golden Dragon and while I like it I feel it's not flawless or his best work. Or the best in Golden Dragon series. |
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Post by a moderator on Jul 17, 2021 12:57:13 GMT
I believe Dave Morris wrote his very first gamebook for Golden Dragon and while I like it I feel it's not flawless or his best work. Or the best in Golden Dragon series. A version of his very first gamebook was indeed published by Golden Dragon, but it wasn't the first in the series, and the original (published in instalments in White Dwarf) had some significant differences, including a more adult tone in places. Have you read the original Castle of Lost Souls, or only the bowdlerised GD variant, or were you talking about a different gamebook that was written later but published as a book first? He's variable in terms of difficulty and maturity, but that is at least in part because different books of his are pitched at different age ranges, and he adapts his writing to the target audience. Not always successfully, but pretty much every other gamebook author I've read who's tried writing for assorted age brackets has done a worse job of it. |
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Post by Charles X. on Jul 17, 2021 13:47:28 GMT
I believe Dave Morris wrote his very first gamebook for Golden Dragon and while I like it I feel it's not flawless or his best work. Or the best in Golden Dragon series. A version of his very first gamebook was indeed published by Golden Dragon, but it wasn't the first in the series, and the original (published in instalments in White Dwarf) had some significant differences, including a more adult tone in places. Have you read the original Castle of Lost Souls, or only the bowdlerised GD variant, or were you talking about a different gamebook that was written later but published as a book first? He's variable in terms of difficulty and maturity, but that is at least in part because different books of his are pitched at different age ranges, and he adapts his writing to the target audience. Not always successfully, but pretty much every other gamebook author I've read who's tried writing for assorted age brackets has done a worse job of it. I have only read the Golden Dragon version of Castle Of Lost Souls, and as you say that and other of his books in Golden Dragon (such as the first book in the series, which I think is one of his earlier works?) and as I say younger author or not I don't think they are perfect. I did find his Can You Brexit? Without Breaking Britain disappointing, but then I bought it knowing I was more left-wing than Dave is, and without his very British, Yes Minister political sense of humour. I did like some of the passages, such as where you can revoke Article 50 and stop Brexit altogether - or knock out the Nigel Farage character by pursuing a radical right-wing Brexit. |
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Post by Charles X. on Jul 17, 2021 14:03:59 GMT
Sorry, I am wording this a bit clumsily. I have read many Dave Morris books, not just Golden Dragon, but the Golden Dragon books of his I have read, some of which I would consider to be his earlier work, I had criticisms of, that's all.
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Post by a moderator on Jul 17, 2021 15:44:24 GMT
That's fair enough. The GD books are among his earlier works, and they do have their flaws. Still, the White Dwarf version of Castle of Lost Souls, which was his first gamebook, cannot really be described as 'for the younger' because of some of the content that didn't make it into the GD text.
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Post by vastariner on Jun 10, 2022 18:20:45 GMT
OK, signs that this is not an FF book, but one adapted into the universe:
-it's a brand new area, so there is no mythology/backstory to incorporate;
-Mortis is the sort of name you give to a baddie in Knightmare, not FF;
-you start with no equipment, so it's basically for a series where having gold is irrelevant (you can buy drinks at the start, for instance);
-that you have no provisions is mental, and suggests Morris completely forgot about restoring stamina. In-universe you would be provided with SOME kit...
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