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Post by stevendoig on Jun 19, 2020 12:40:32 GMT
I really enjoyed my playthroughs on my 'six shotties' thread.
I think it would have made a better gamebook if it wasn't a fighting fantasy one though, it felt sort of forced, and probably could have been re written into a really good basic 'Choose Your Own adventure' style.
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Post by Law on Jun 19, 2020 12:45:27 GMT
"Fighting Fantasy" (check transport logistics)This book was exciting as doing your tax returns.
Plus the hopelessly dated lingo and breakneck speed of its pacing didn't help matters.
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kieran
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Post by kieran on Jun 19, 2020 13:22:12 GMT
"Fighting Fantasy" (check transport logistics)This book was exciting as doing your tax returns.
Plus the hopelessly dated lingo and breakneck speed of its pacing didn't help matters.
Some of the lingo is pretty cringe alright, no denying that.
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Post by a moderator on Jun 19, 2020 14:06:38 GMT
You take that back, Mister Zero.
Okay, fair point.
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Post by The Count on Jun 19, 2020 20:33:58 GMT
I think all the Science Fiction type FF books suffered from having to fit into a system that wasn't designed for them, and were written primarily by and for Fantasy enthusiasts - not every lover of fantasy likes sci fi and vice versa.
Rings of Kether isn't a bad book, is mostly well written with some decent set pieces, but there is something missing. If it written as a 20s or 50s detective story, it would be amazing.
One of the best of the bad bunch regarding the Sci Fi lot when you look at those 8 together, which makes it at most a low end of the average for a FF book.
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Post by a moderator on Jun 30, 2020 13:36:40 GMT
For years I've known that the first edition of this book included an incorrect reference number at one point (section 346 says 263 when it should say 268), which was corrected for later print runs. However, today I learned that that's not the only change that was made.
I only own a first edition, so I can't check to see the full extent of the changes, but I do now know that the Stamina-replenishing Pep Pills were changed to Energy Tablets, and section 333's confiscation of your previously unmentioned spy ray has been removed. I wonder if that's all that's different.
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Post by Wilf on Jun 30, 2020 20:10:11 GMT
New fact! Good fact! Sadly, mine is also a first edition, so I can't verify that...
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Jun 30, 2020 20:43:53 GMT
Confirmed. I have a copy printed in 1987. In this version Energy Pills not Pep Pills [for YEARS I'd not noticed this - the first time I read the book was from the Library when it first came out, which had Pep Pills in it] Section 346 gives options to go to 268 or 307. No mention of a spy ray in para 333. Let me know if you want me to type out the whole paragraph for you to compare.
How'd you find this out, if you don't mind me asking?
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Post by a moderator on Jun 30, 2020 23:06:20 GMT
How'd you find this out, if you don't mind me asking? The section number error was mentioned in an issue of Warlock magazine. The rest I figured out based on a podcast. The presenters were playing (and mocking) The Rings of Kether, and got a bit confused when the text in their respective copies of the book didn't match. Since my last post I've listened to more of the podcast, and learned that the mention of Pep Pills at section 350 also got fixed.
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Post by Charles X. on Jul 16, 2021 18:20:44 GMT
This is one of the better sci-fi FF books, above the poor Starship Traveller and the dire Skylord, just not as good as the overrated, overlong Rebel Planet. The plot is reminiscent of Phillip K. Dick or George Lucas, and the difficulty level is about right.
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Post by bloodbeasthandler on Apr 12, 2022 14:57:29 GMT
It amuses me to speculate on what the conversation at Puffin must have been like about the inclusion of the term 'pep pills'.... something along the lines of ..'you do know that means drugs, don't you?.. as in speed and stuff?'
And below is some footage of one of your colleagues in Federal Central (Vice) 'pepping themselves up a bit' before investigating some instances of vandalism (stone throwing and breaking windows) taking place elsewhere in the Aleph Cygni system.
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Apr 12, 2022 15:23:08 GMT
Haha, reminds me of the scene in the first episode of Star Trek TNG, humanity on trial scene, where Q summons up drugged-up soldiers from 2100 or something to prove human beings are uncivilized. As a kid I felt queasy about the slave trade in Seas of Blood, which wouldn't get a free pass these days (like the borderline racism in Lone Wolf, where mentioning skin colour in terms of praise and criticism was rather outdated when the books were published in the eighties). I'm pretty sure Puffin publisher didn't give one as long as they made money. In fact, given the number of errors Puffin let's slip through, and the fact they greenlit Sky Lord and Eye of the Dragon, I'm 100% sure.
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Post by zoove on Aug 18, 2022 12:13:58 GMT
Just working my way through this one. And I might be sleep deprived from my toddler but is there a bug in this entry? I visited the island off the coast where you meet the riddle robot or/ and the killer dog bot but after meeting Mrs Corvus and going after the customs agent I was sent back to the same island after a trip into space to investigate a satellite. It’s worth noting I failed the luck test when I met the agent trying to climb out the window. Maybe that has something to do with it?
Also. That riddle! Antares. Who the hell would know that? Least of all people in the age group this book was aimed at. I was racking my brain for ages on that one.
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Post by a moderator on Aug 18, 2022 13:07:47 GMT
Either there's a misprint in your copy of the book, or you must have turned to the wrong section. After the riddle robot you get to a junction, at which one turning leads to a dead end, while the other goes to a confrontation with Zera Gross.
Maybe you turned to 142 when you should have gone to 145.
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Post by soulreaver on Apr 6, 2023 13:19:07 GMT
Here's something interesting... In the original printing of the book, at (333), there's this event with the spaceport customs agents:
"Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology. And this,' says one of them, finding your spy ray, 'is an example of it. I'm sorry, this device is a prohibited import and as such will not be returned to you. Good-day.' They leave the spacecraft. Cross the spy ray off your Equipment List. Rather brusque treatment, and they didn't even check your cargo ..."
This of course did create a problem because never does the book say you're carrying a Spy Ray (and losing it has no effect on anything in the book) so later reprints changed it to this:
"Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology.' They search your ship, making a mess everywhere they go, but they find nothing illegal and eventually leave the spacecraft."
The thing is, the reprint actually seems to miss the point of the original: it hints at the corrupt nature of the customs officers and that they're expecting you (or someone like you). Not only are they not looking for drugs, but they try to hinder your investigation by seizing equipment that (presumably) would help you in your line of work, all while having plausible deniability. The fact they don't bother to even check your cargo strongly suggests they were there specifically just to mess with you.
In the reprint they are smug and rude, but just seem to be doing their job.
I prefer the original.
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kieran
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Post by kieran on Apr 6, 2023 14:12:35 GMT
Here's something interesting... In the original printing of the book, at (333), there's this an event with the spaceport customs agents: "Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology. And this,' says one of them, finding your spy ray, 'is an example of it. I'm sorry, this device is a prohibited import and as such will not be returned to you. Good-day.' They leave the spacecraft. Cross the spy ray off your Equipment List. Rather brusque treatment, and they didn't even check your cargo ..." This of course did create a problem because never does the book say you're carrying a Spy Ray (and losing it has no effect on anything in the book) so later reprints changed it to this: "Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology.' They search your ship, making a mess everywhere they go, but they find nothing illegal and eventually leave the spacecraft." The thing is, the reprint actually seems to miss the point of the original: it hints at the corrupt nature of the customs officers and that they're expecting you (or someone like you). Not only are they not looking for drugs, but they try to hinder your investigation by seizing equipment that (presumably) would help you in your line of work, all while having plausible deniability. The fact they don't bother to even check your cargo strongly suggests they were there specifically just to mess with you. In the reprint they are smug and rude, but just seem to be doing their job. I prefer the original. Agreed. A much better fix would have been just to add a line saying you're carrying a spy ray (with a very brief explanation for what it's for) in the instructions or background.
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Post by a moderator on Apr 6, 2023 16:17:38 GMT
For years I've known that the first edition of this book included an incorrect reference number at one point (section 346 says 263 when it should say 268), which was corrected for later print runs. However, today I learned that that's not the only change that was made. I only own a first edition, so I can't check to see the full extent of the changes, but I do now know that the Stamina-replenishing Pep Pills were changed to Energy Tablets, and section 333's confiscation of your previously unmentioned spy ray has been removed. I wonder if that's all that's different. Here's something interesting... In the original printing of the book, at (333), there's this an event with the spaceport customs agents: "Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology. And this,' says one of them, finding your spy ray, 'is an example of it. I'm sorry, this device is a prohibited import and as such will not be returned to you. Good-day.' They leave the spacecraft. Cross the spy ray off your Equipment List. Rather brusque treatment, and they didn't even check your cargo ..." This of course did create a problem because never does the book say you're carrying a Spy Ray (and losing it has no effect on anything in the book) so later reprints changed it to this: "Your ship is towed to its parking-space where, to your dismay, you are boarded by several Customs officers looking for contraband. 'What, drugs?' you ask. They look at you smugly before replying. 'No, technology.' They search your ship, making a mess everywhere they go, but they find nothing illegal and eventually leave the spacecraft." The thing is, the reprint actually seems to miss the point of the original: it hints at the corrupt nature of the customs officers and that they're expecting you (or someone like you). Not only are they not looking for drugs, but they try to hinder your investigation by seizing equipment that (presumably) would help you in your line of work, all while having plausible deniability. The fact they don't bother to even check your cargo strongly suggests they were there specifically just to mess with you. In the reprint they are smug and rude, but just seem to be doing their job. I prefer the original. Thanks for providing a bit more detail on the edit, soulreaver.
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Post by scouserob on Mar 14, 2024 11:18:03 GMT
Pre-Game Impressions
I’m looking forward to this one with a mixture of intrigue and fatigue. I remember nothing of this gamebook from my youth and I’m not going to look at the synopsis on the back.
Intrigue: I’m a Narc! Cool. So I’m going to be imagining myself as Hank from Breaking Bad or Pedro Pascal’s character in Narcos. It seems that the initial part of the gamebook is going to be an investigation which sounds like a rather interesting change from the usual assassination/fetch quests. The name of the gamebook is great. What are the Rings alluded to in the title? Literal bobby George style rings? Drug rings? I don’t know and it will be fun to find out. The cover is fantastic. I have no idea who that fellow is but I’m imagining that it is Kether’s version of Pablo Escobar. (Or maybe the local, corrupt, chief of police.) In any case, he looks to have been in some scrapes to get in his current position, those are some nasty scars. Great clothes and a fantastic office with a view. Love that blaster lying on the console in front of him as he casually rests his considerable chin on his hands.
Fatigue: It is Andrew Chapman’s second gamebook and the third space based one. The previous 2 are my least favourite of the first 14. Many of the internal illustrations include a lot of sterile consoles, control panels, desolate planets etc. I want to be excited about getting to the picture accompanying paragraphs not shrugging my shoulders indifferently.
Still, I do like the alternate, roll less than your Skill to hit, combat mechanics in them (and Freeway Fighter). Blaster fights with 4 Stamina loss and Ship battles with 1 Shields loss (from a maximum of 6!) sound intense. The insta-kill missiles make a welcome return from Freeway Fighter, where deciding what or whom to use them on added a layer of complexity.
Other traditional science fiction Fighting Fantasy mechanics include not being able to use Luck in battle and being able to pop a Stamina recovering tablet mid-fight. The second of these made Space Assassin a little bit too easy on the golden path, so I wonder if it will have a similar effect in The Rings of Kether.
I have a completely empty Equipment and Weapons box on my Adventure Sheet pre-paragraph 1. I assume I’m carrying a blaster, but with my Travelling Salesman disguise I’m not sure yet.
Also the Initial Weapons Strength isn’t recorded, which seems a little incongruous.
Anyhow, there is no existing app out there to play this on the move so I will again be creating my own, especially after how much it added to the experience of playing, and trying out new strategies during, Secrets of Salamonis. I’ve got the pre-game stat rolls and Mission Briefing done so far:
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Mar 15, 2024 20:01:40 GMT
"Fighting Fantasy" (check transport logistics)This book was exciting as doing your tax returns.
Plus the hopelessly dated lingo and breakneck speed of its pacing didn't help matters.
My apologies for replying to a multi-year old comment but... that's strong criticism. Might even say, harsh. My thinking was the pacing was fast to make the adventurer feel like they were a sci-fi bounty hunter. Guess its subjective whether you like sci-fi FF like whether you like Sir Ian's work or Steve's. I'm also doing a flip and wondering what tax returns are more exciting than being a bounty hunter in the future in space, like a so-called creative accountant.
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Post by scouserob on Apr 6, 2024 9:58:38 GMT
I'm enjoying this quite a bit so far.
Compared to the endless corridors of Chapman's previous gamebook Space Assassin (albeit punctuated with the odd torus shaped planet and tank battle game) the sheer variety of locations of The Rings of Kether is both refreshing and a little overwhelming.
The giant clue hunt has finally converged back to a single location for me, an island.
I even had to create a little location/set piece flow chart to keep track of everything.
Here it is:
My favourite set pieces so far:
Playing cards with Zera Gross and her Goons in the Canteen: My Narc makes some very clumsy allusions to the drug trade and gets beaten up so badly he permanently reduces his Initial Stamina. 🤦🏻♂️😂
The Botanic Gardens and the Car Chase: I missed Popeye Doyle out of my Narc character list above, and this car chase is reminiscent, in its length, of the chase in the French Connection. The whole set piece, which is mostly the car chase, covers 65 paragraphs.
Asteroid C230: So many clues pointed to this place. I was sure there would be some kind of drug lab in there.
Nope, it is a magnificent red herring. The place is a freaky monastery with a group of monks worshipping Thuvald, '... a Mind Parasite. One of the great old ones from ancient Kyth.' Oh, and you get to meet Thuvald!
What??? 🤷🏻♂️ Love it. 😎👍🏻
Anyhow, I'm looking forward to the rest.
My best guess for the cover star, so far, is the enormous desk/huge investigator combination from paragraph 96. Though there is also the internal illustration accompanying massive desk/equally massive but certainly uglier woman combo on paragraph 151. The view from the window on the cover doesn't match either but the cover star looks masculine and seems to be wearing a uniform.
Goodness knows, maybe there'll be even more combinations of massive people behind massive desks to choose from on the island and beyond...
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Per
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Post by Per on Apr 6, 2024 12:56:52 GMT
The cover image should be for 360 as pointed out here. (Although if not, it wouldn't have been the first time two artists created very different visuals from the same art brief.)
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Post by scouserob on Apr 6, 2024 13:29:45 GMT
The cover image should be for 360 as pointed out here. (Although if not, it wouldn't have been the first time two artists created very different visuals from the same art brief.) Wow another massive desk/person combination! (Somewhere in my Narc's future.) I've had a quick sneaky peek at 360 and the rest of the action in that room. The mention of the blaster on the desk does tie up with the cover picture, However, I'm still seeing a uniformed investigator trying to reassure me there are no drugs on Kether rather than Zera Gross. 🤷🏻♂️
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Post by scouserob on Apr 6, 2024 13:35:09 GMT
Love this cover! Anyhow, it seems as though it is the Investigator on paragraph 96. (Although it could be a generic larger fellow.) After a bit of digging... On Terry Oakes' Facebook Page, a repost from his son: Well, I can honestly say this fat guy has never looked as good as he does now. Pleased with this remaster of The Rings of Kether, from the Fighting Fantasy game book. Been given the thumbs up by the artist…aka…papa…aka…the leg-end…aka…Terry Oakes too.Also from Terry Oakes himself: The fat man, who was based on a thin man, is off to a new home.
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Per
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Post by Per on Apr 6, 2024 14:26:24 GMT
It does look more like a man than a woman (ugly or otherwise), but the blaster and asteroid landscape point to the Gross scene, and even if it shows 96, the guy is not the "ageing and sleepy" uniformed proctor, who steps out at the start of the second paragraph, but someone who's supposed to be "jolly" and "jovial". Barring a more detailed account from Oakes, I would tend to think it's a mashup of the two scenes at best.
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kieran
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Post by kieran on Apr 6, 2024 17:30:27 GMT
I missed Popeye Doyle out of my Narc character list above, and this car chase is reminiscent, in its length, of the chase in the French Connection. Chapman actually based it on one of the chases from the first Mad Max film. To be honest, it feels more French Connection-y to me too.
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Post by paperexplorer on Apr 6, 2024 23:09:47 GMT
The funny thing is, I always thought the cover image was a man, until one day I read 360 and made the connection to the cover and was embarrassed to have thought an image of zera gross ever was a man.
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Post by scouserob on Apr 6, 2024 23:20:22 GMT
Barring a more detailed account from Oakes, I would tend to think it's a mashup of the two scenes at best. Mr. Oakes was kind enough to reply to an enquiry on this matter. Unfortunately, he doesn’t remember where the cover star comes from. He does remember that he used a photo of a very thin man as a reference. 😀
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