kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Sept 8, 2021 12:07:39 GMT
The combat in the Golden Dragon series of gamebook is similar to what you are describing that. In combat, only "stamina" is necessary. You simply roll 2 dice: if you score, let's say, 2-4 your enemy "wins" the round and you lose a predetermined amount of Stamina; if you score higher, the enemy loses a predetermined amount of Stamina. Fights against more powerful enemies changes the number required to roll in order to win and the damage done and subjected by the enemy. It's a combat system that should fairly easily allow the author to keep fights fair and balanced. Though the Golden Dragon authors often failed in that respect!
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Post by sunil on Oct 28, 2021 20:37:08 GMT
Not QUITE an FF Gamebook, right? I mean the combat system!
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Sept 7, 2022 16:53:46 GMT
I ordered today Blood of the Zombies. I AM trustfull it Will BE an awesome book, and amazing adventure. Looking forward to feel this outstanding Journey. My assumptions of the greatness of this book is due to the vast majority of the comments here that say that crypt of the Sorcerer is a bad book, crypt of the Sorcerer - the most perfect masterpiece that Livingstone made.
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Post by paperexplorer on Sept 8, 2022 13:42:52 GMT
Is there anywhere it can be bought for a reasonable price?
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Sept 10, 2022 23:38:02 GMT
Caverns of the Snow Witch, Freeway Fighter and Forest of Doom were boring enough, but Blood of the Zombie sets a new standard for bad My God, (matter of speaking, i dont CARE about God), can 2 persons view the same world in diferent ways or not? Caverns was a Pearl! I bet you didnt like Crypt of the Sorcerer either, did you?
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Post by Wilf on Sept 15, 2022 21:24:51 GMT
I ordered today Blood of the Zombies. I AM trustfull it Will BE an awesome book... From the Rankings thread two years ago: 77th (out of 77): BLOOD OF THE ZOMBIES by IAN LIVINGSTONE. Average Score: 1.428 (out of 10). This is the only book which no-one scored higher than a 5/10. It also earned five 0/10s - more than any other title. Interested to know why you think it will be awesome...
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Sept 16, 2022 8:53:57 GMT
I ordered today Blood of the Zombies. I AM trustfull it Will BE an awesome book... From the Rankings thread two years ago: 77th (out of 77): BLOOD OF THE ZOMBIES by IAN LIVINGSTONE. Average Score: 1.428 (out of 10). This is the only book which no-one scored higher than a 5/10. It also earned five 0/10s - more than any other title. Interested to know why you think it will be awesome... As he said in his post, he doesn't agree with what is pretty much the general consensus here about Crypt Of The Sorceror. Ian Livingstone is rated a bit higher in other FF forums such as Facebook and Youtube than he is here, and presumably Vagsancho doesn't take the gameplay issues as seriously as we do (Vagsancho either cheats, or assumes rolling perfect start-up stats and plays ridiculously at a time). Ian Livingstone has definitely written some very good FF, not only Deathtrap Dungeon but several others. Blood Of The Zombies I fear wouldn't be enjoyable even to the most die-hard Livingstone fan, but if Vagsancho unexpectedly finds it 'awesome', that's his call.
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Post by tyrion on Sept 17, 2022 14:29:37 GMT
I actually like blood of the zombies. The art is terrific, considering it is mainly zombies, and Ian's writing seems as engaging as ever. But I do cheat my way through it.
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Post by slloyd14 on Sept 17, 2022 15:21:15 GMT
I quite liked it. Ian experimented with a new combat system that allowed you to use different weapons and have different weapon rules.
He set it in modern times with zombies. The art is great. It is a shame that it is broken, but I loved what Ian was trying to do here.
Also, it seems that Ian is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. People don't like the books he is known for (Northern Allansian scavenger hunts) but don't like his attempts at something different either.
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Post by nathanh on Sept 17, 2022 15:48:07 GMT
I have only played the app version, but my impression is that this is only a working combat system away from being a perfectly fine book (I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly either but that's right at the end so it doesn't really stop the book being playable).
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Post by a moderator on Sept 17, 2022 16:45:19 GMT
Also, it seems that Ian is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. People don't like the books he is known for (Northern Allansian scavenger hunts) but don't like his attempts at something different either. The dislike isn't because it's different. It's because it's unplayable.
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Post by slloyd14 on Sept 17, 2022 20:41:20 GMT
Also, it seems that Ian is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. People don't like the books he is known for (Northern Allansian scavenger hunts) but don't like his attempts at something different either. The dislike isn't because it's different. It's because it's unplayable. To quote Nigel Tufnall from Spinal Tap 'Yeah, well that's just nit picking, innit?'
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Sept 18, 2022 10:19:15 GMT
I have only played the app version, but my impression is that this is only a working combat system away from being a perfectly fine book (I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly either but that's right at the end so it doesn't really stop the book being playable). I Fully disagree with the criterium of unplayability to say One FF book is bad. Crypt of the Sorcerer was always my favourite
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Sept 18, 2022 10:32:05 GMT
I have only played the app version, but my impression is that this is only a working combat system away from being a perfectly fine book (I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly either but that's right at the end so it doesn't really stop the book being playable). I Fully disagree with the criterium of unplayability to say One FF book is bad. Crypt of the Sorcerer was always my favourite Vagsancho, just out of interest - what is your view of Shadow Of The Giants, if it isn't a personal question? I think it's one of Livingstone's best.
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Post by nathanh on Sept 19, 2022 8:18:41 GMT
I have only played the app version, but my impression is that this is only a working combat system away from being a perfectly fine book (I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly either but that's right at the end so it doesn't really stop the book being playable). I Fully disagree with the criterium of unplayability to say One FF book is bad. Crypt of the Sorcerer was always my favourite Totally reasonable. Similarly, I rate Spellbreaker fairly high.
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Post by firebead on Sept 19, 2022 8:39:29 GMT
Unplayability is the first and foremost criterium to rate a GAMEbook. If you can't win it legitimately, better write a novel. Nobody in their right minds would say that a videogame is good if it's unplayable...
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Post by scouserob on Sept 19, 2022 9:28:38 GMT
Unplayability is the first and foremost criterium to rate a GAMEbook. If you can't win it legitimately, better write a novel. Nobody in their right minds would say that a videogame is good if it's unplayable... You mustn’t have played Shadow of the Beast 2. 😉 (I still remember ten pints. The game was tough even with that.) A game can still be fun (and maybe even good) even if it is practically unwinnable. I enjoyed Blood of the Zombies quite a bit on each of my genuine, if futile, attempts to escape with my life. I also enjoyed mapping it out once realising (via Champskees' solution probabilities) that I'd never complete it. Good art, good atmosphere, and completely and utterly broken. Shame. The Tin Man Games version has a good go of making it winnable. (Even though I have all of these, they usually annoy me by making things easier, even in adventurer mode. Like the reduced skill of the opponents in Island of the Lizard King’s two beach fights, or skill bonuses counting as attack strength bonuses.)
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Post by paperexplorer on Sept 19, 2022 11:17:35 GMT
A video game being too hard is a good analogy because tough games can be fun when you have a cheat code for unlimited lives/health. Playing FF and choosing to win battles or be lucky is like using a cheat code, you can relax and enjoy the ride
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Sept 19, 2022 18:52:00 GMT
I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly. I see the requirement "did you kill every zombie?" as a very good thing!! It avoids horrible shortcuts to the end as in Keep of the Lich Lord. I ONLY hope the book hás a justification to such requirement.
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Post by slloyd14 on Sept 19, 2022 19:23:07 GMT
I have only played the app version, but my impression is that this is only a working combat system away from being a perfectly fine book (I know the "did you kill every zombie" requirement isn't very friendly either but that's right at the end so it doesn't really stop the book being playable). I see the requirement "did you kill every zombie?" as a very good thing!! It avoids horrible shortcuts to the end as in Keep of the Lich Lord. I ONLY hope the book hás a justification to such requirement. Any zombies you don't kill escape and infect more people.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,458
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Sept 20, 2022 8:45:41 GMT
Unplayability is the first and foremost criterium to rate a GAMEbook. If you can't win it legitimately, better write a novel. Nobody in their right minds would say that a videogame is good if it's unplayable... I wouldn't say Crypt is unplayable though - you can explore 99% of the gamebook just fine. It's just you will probably never beat Razaak. It's more like a videogame where the final boss is way too hard than something like Big Rigs. There are gamebooks that I would say verge on unplayable - references lead to the wrong places, the book fails to take account of actions the reader may have taken etc. Crypt is a long way from that. Plus gamebooks have an advantage in that the reader can set their own rules to an extent - there's nothing stopping the reader from deciding the prohibition on going above your Initial Skill rule applies only to healing and not to equipment for instance and thereby allowing the Defender to raise their Skill to 13. Such an approach is only possible in videogames with built in cheats or hacks.
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Post by hallucination on Sept 20, 2022 10:45:07 GMT
A game can still be fun (and maybe even good) even if it is practically unwinnable. I enjoyed Blood of the Zombies quite a bit on each of my genuine, if futile, attempts to escape with my life. Blood of the Zombies - the Ski Free of game books
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Nov 12, 2022 19:23:01 GMT
I won for the first time Blood of the Zombies today. More One time, i do not identify with the majority of negative reviews ive read. It is defineately a good book. Very thrilling. The Change of rules was not relevant to me.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,678
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Nov 12, 2022 20:13:40 GMT
I won for the first time Blood of the Zombies today. More One time, i do not identify with the majority of negative reviews ive read. It is defineately a good book. Very thrilling. The Change of rules was not relevant to me. I believe everything I read on the internet.
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Nov 12, 2022 21:15:53 GMT
I won for the first time Blood of the Zombies today. More One time, i do not identify with the majority of negative reviews ive read. It is defineately a good book. Very thrilling. The Change of rules was not relevant to me. I believe everything I read on the internet. I'm not very good at subtext but I believe that was facetious and\or sarcasm.* I don't know what the majority of people, young people, and aforementioned people on the internet think about gamebook difficulty, Ian Livingstone's gamebooks, and whether we have the same subjective views, neither do I care, or even think it matters. I'm fine - I agree - with the majority here reckoning gameplay difficulty is important, and on that basis Blood Of The Zombies and to a lesser extent Crypt Of The Sorceror are too unplayable to be great gamebooks or even above-average gamebooks, whatever their other merits might be. In Vagsancho's defence Gates Of Death has both real rubbish gameplay and is real rubbish in other respects, but I'd say that's like pointing out you have a second-hand car instead of a new car.
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Nov 18, 2022 18:57:07 GMT
Very good book, very thrilling. With the most slaughtery of all books. A crazy Run for killing almost all the instants of the book. Not very atmospherical (thats not Ian strength). Even só defineately a well designed good book.
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Post by dragonwarrior8 on Nov 18, 2022 20:27:02 GMT
Very good book, very thrilling. With the most slaughtery of all books. A crazy Run for killing almost all the instants of the book. Not very atmospherical (thats not Ian strength). Even só defineately a well designed good book. Funny. I always thought atmosphere was one of Ian's best strengths.
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Post by philsadler on Nov 18, 2022 23:08:23 GMT
Well designed? Funny. I thought it was one long impossible corridor.
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vagsancho
Knight
Posts: 809
Favourite Gamebook Series: CRYPT OF THE SORCERER
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Post by vagsancho on Nov 19, 2022 22:44:33 GMT
Well designed? Funny. I thought it was one long impossible corridor. It was well designed. It is a good book. Só much negative sayings... Oh my God.. it is a very good book.. from the beginning to the end... A very much good designed adventure... The villain is a very good designed villain... Always presente... And totaly mad... Yes... A very good book
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Post by philsadler on Nov 20, 2022 7:03:27 GMT
In what way was it well designed?
Are you sure you don't just like the author and not the product?
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