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Post by tyrion on Jan 28, 2020 22:58:58 GMT
Nice analysis. I always just thought it was one of Ian's dungeons (but in a forest) he tends to produce with rng, including random finding of key items scattered about.
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kieran
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Post by kieran on Jan 28, 2020 22:59:47 GMT
Those are some pretty cool theories! I find it weird that the second goblin is in the locked crypt. How did he get in? Or did someone lock him in after he entered by the door?
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Post by vastariner on Jan 28, 2020 23:47:33 GMT
It is interesting that within the FF world there are two ways of looking at the forest. Like most people, your character considers the wooded area to be Darkwood Forest, but there is also a view that both the wooded area and the area encompassed by the wooded area is Darkwood Forest (for example, this how the forest is labeled on Bigleg’s map). I think this reflects a (medieval) human way of thinking about forests, as the nobles who claimed ownership of the forest would extend their claim to the whole area, including the plains, hills, rivers, and un-wooded parts within the forest boundaries. Indeed, when William the Bastard set up the royal forests, the word "forest" did not designate a wooded area specifically, but any area preserved for royal hunting only. "Forest" derives from a word meaning "outside".
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Post by schlendrian on Jan 29, 2020 9:53:55 GMT
Peasantscribbler, that was a very interesting (and well researched) read, thanks for that. I always find it highly interesting, how the ways of thinking change with time and watching Allansia through a medieval mindset is certainly very viable. Vastariner, thanks for the addendum as well.
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Post by peasantscribbler on Jan 29, 2020 14:51:43 GMT
Nice analysis. I always just thought it was one of Ian's dungeons (but in a forest) he tends to produce with rng, including random finding of key items scattered about. I think Ian got better in some ways after Forest of Doom. I mean, he still made you find tons of items hidden in random places, but he seemed to put more effort into writing his backstories and encounters so that things seemed more connected and less random. Forest of Doom was still a bit wild in this respect. I read somewhere that the Trolltooth Wars retrospectively provided some plausible reason for the Warlock leaving his treasure box keys scattered about under Firetop Mountain. I may have to find a copy, because I've never been able to come up with an explanation for this.
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kieran
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Post by kieran on Jan 29, 2020 15:20:39 GMT
he seemed to put more effort into writing his backstories and encounters so that things seemed more connected and less random. Not sure I would agree with that. Forest of Doom is at least set in a fairly small geographical area. While as in Crypt of the Sorcerer: you can find an engraving of the combination code for Razaak's front door on some random stone hundreds of miles from his lair And in Return to Firetop Mountain: you can find a key just outside Stonebridge that is used to unlock something within Firetop Mountain If I recall correctly, one of his minions stole and scattered the keys.
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Post by peasantscribbler on Jan 29, 2020 20:23:17 GMT
he seemed to put more effort into writing his backstories and encounters so that things seemed more connected and less random. Not sure I would agree with that. Forest of Doom is at least set in a fairly small geographical area. While as in Crypt of the Sorcerer: you can find an engraving of the combination code for Razaak's front door on some random stone hundreds of miles from his lair And in Return to Firetop Mountain: you can find a key just outside Stonebridge that is used to unlock something within Firetop Mountain If I recall correctly, one of his minions stole and scattered the keys. Yeah, I probably can't make a case for 'more connected'--those examples are pretty egregious!
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Post by The Count on Jun 21, 2020 0:22:35 GMT
When I first read this, I ended up being annoyed by something about it, which was probably it being quite simple and lacking in the number crunching I was used to from FF as it was somehow one of the last books I discovered. The art didn't help as the latest reprint art is an improvement!
So I decided to have a go recently. Aware of one essential item I needed to buy at the start, I decided not to bother with it as I think you can get something similar within the forest. If you can, I never found it. What I did find was not one, not two but THREE identical and supposedly unique hammer handles (thanks to the ridiculous option to just walk around and reenter at the same point). At this point, I gave up completely and made a cup of tea.
Tea finished, I killed off this character in the clone mine (as the lack of gratuitous Skill 12 opponents made combat survivable) and rolled up a new one, pretending that the above never happened, bought the right items and was able to get through with only two hammer handles and the one hammer head. Still didn't have to do a lot of fighting so would probably be able to get a few more duplicates.
Having said that - as a series starter, it isn't that bad as there are some good parts to explore and it isn't obvious if you have gone the wrong way. If you treat the "you failed but can go around the outside then try again" as an instant death, it may even be average.
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IoannesKantakouzenos
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Post by IoannesKantakouzenos on Jun 13, 2022 16:20:13 GMT
So, Forest of Doom. Which, for us, was Forest of Death and #02 - why this was switched with Citadel of Chaos is something I'll never know.
Once again, who translated this book to Portuguese had no ruddy idea of what they were doing. So, instead of dwarves, we have "duendes", which is more closely related to Elves; Goblins became simply Monsters; the Ghoul is once again a Vampire; the Wyvern was turned into a Dragon; the Boulder Beast is more accurately called a "Stone Animal"; the Wild Hill Men are "Hill Giants"; Hobgoblins regain the new designation of Trasgo; and, last but not least, the hammer-snatching Goblins are renamed as Demons. Also, (396) has a typo, where if you want to attack the dog, the book tells you to turn to (596). Apart from that, the Forest is depicted as a dungeon, with one way in and one way out, which doesn't make much sense to me, I may say. The illustrations are far inferior than the ones of TWoFM, that dismal Catwoman just adds more insult to injury, and I still say that the illo in (351) should rather be in (292), because that is when you have lit up a candle - and I happen to like that particular one, but that is my thing with crypts and creatures of the undead.
... And then we have the whole restart/reset button thing. Talisman of Death handles it a helluva lot better than this one. Personally, I'd kill off the character at (98) and be done with it...
From the first 4 books, I'd rank it at 3rd spot (still beats Starship Traveller, even if that is no real feat). Sorry about that, Ian.
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CharlesX
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Post by CharlesX on Jun 13, 2022 17:00:32 GMT
So, Forest of Doom. Which, for us, was Forest of Death and #02 - why this was switched with Citadel of Chaos is something I'll never know.
Once again, who translated this book to Portuguese had no ruddy idea of what they were doing. So, instead of dwarves, we have "duendes", which is more closely related to Elves; Goblins became simply Monsters; the Ghoul is once again a Vampire; the Wyvern was turned into a Dragon; the Boulder Beast is more accurately called a "Stone Animal"; the Wild Hill Men are "Hill Giants"; Hobgoblins regain the new designation of Trasgo; and, last but not least, the hammer-snatching Goblins are renamed as Demons. Also, (396) has a typo, where if you want to attack the dog, the book tells you to turn to (596). Apart from that, the Forest is depicted as a dungeon, with one way in and one way out, which doesn't make much sense to me, I may say. The illustrations are far inferior than the ones of TWoFM, that dismal Catwoman just adds more insult to injury, and I still say that the illo in (351) should rather be in (292), because that is when you have lit up a candle - and I happen to like that particular one, but that is my thing with crypts and creatures of the undead.
... And then we have the whole restart/reset button thing. Talisman of Death handles it a helluva lot better than this one. Personally, I'd kill off the character at (98) and be done with it...
From the first 4 books, I'd rank it at 3rd spot (still beats Starship Traveller, even if that is no real feat). Sorry about that, Ian.
Good to know. Thank goodness we English don't have terrible translations from different countries into our own language * cough * Jules Verne * cough *.
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Post by slloyd14 on Aug 2, 2022 21:47:20 GMT
What always confused me was that the dust of levitation was found with a random strong man because it seemed to me that it was just the sort of thing that Yaztromo would sell.
It's almost like Ian Livingstone originally had Yaztromo sell it but then decided that it would make the book too easy and found a random place to put it instead.
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sylas
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Post by sylas on Aug 3, 2022 15:04:00 GMT
What always confused me was that the dust of levitation was found with a random strong man because it seemed to me that it was just the sort of thing that Yaztromo would sell.
It's almost like Ian Livingstone originally had Yaztromo sell it but then decided that it would make the book too easy and found a random place to put it instead. He saw a business opportunity and took it. Bet Yaztromo used to have loads of it until some random guy bought the whole stock.
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Post by slloyd14 on Aug 3, 2022 16:35:15 GMT
What always confused me was that the dust of levitation was found with a random strong man because it seemed to me that it was just the sort of thing that Yaztromo would sell.
It's almost like Ian Livingstone originally had Yaztromo sell it but then decided that it would make the book too easy and found a random place to put it instead. He saw a business opportunity and took it. Bet Yaztromo used to have loads of it until some random guy bought the whole stock. Maybe he was going to float it on the stock market.
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IoannesKantakouzenos
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Post by IoannesKantakouzenos on Aug 8, 2022 15:53:56 GMT
What always confused me was that the dust of levitation was found with a random strong man because it seemed to me that it was just the sort of thing that Yaztromo would sell.
It's almost like Ian Livingstone originally had Yaztromo sell it but then decided that it would make the book too easy and found a random place to put it instead. It would be too easy to have Yaztromo sell it. So I guess Quin won some arm-wrestling challenge with Y and managed to get all of his levitation dust - because, y'know, that item is very important for a bodybuilder.
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Post by paperexplorer on Aug 8, 2022 22:03:26 GMT
Or maybe the strong man bought it off yaztromo?
But I like the idea he and yaz were arm wrestling and he won it better
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