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Post by CharlesX on Aug 27, 2023 13:26:04 GMT
Where's my favourite stupid "Dying by driving a ship full of people straight into a black hole because you are homesick"? Unacceptable because a question needs to have more than one correct answer to be suitable for a quiz of this type. So, if it's a different reference\way of dying but the same gamebook, it's just as many points? Bit academic to me as I probably won't be playing.
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Post by a moderator on Aug 27, 2023 14:06:09 GMT
Unacceptable because a question needs to have more than one correct answer to be suitable for a quiz of this type. So, if it's a different reference\way of dying but the same gamebook, it's just as many points? Bit academic to me as I probably won't be playing.
Starship Traveller only contains one instance of flying into a black hole 'because you are homesick' (as schlendrian put it). The other 'plunge into a black hole' deaths are because you got the wrong coordinates/time. And this is all academic anyway, since 'Dying by entering a black hole' isn't on Peter's list.
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Post by Peter on Aug 28, 2023 6:07:57 GMT
Yes it needs to be totally dying all at once, not accumulated stamina loss.
If it is a different instance of dying, it is unique, but if it is the same situation described on two difference references, it is a duplicate.
I didn't think of the black hole annihilation method of dying. What an oversight! They would all be unique, as they are all different black holes, in different sectors and on different dates.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,680
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Aug 28, 2023 9:44:42 GMT
Yes it needs to be totally dying all at once, not accumulated stamina loss. If it is a different instance of dying, it is unique, but if it is the same situation described on two difference references, it is a duplicate. I didn't think of the black hole annihilation method of dying. What an oversight! They would all be unique, as they are all different black holes, in different sectors and on different dates. Do these have to be Instant Death paragraphs?
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Post by vastariner on Aug 28, 2023 14:06:43 GMT
I didn't think of the black hole annihilation method of dying. What an oversight! They would all be unique, as they are all different black holes, in different sectors and on different dates. There's another book of black hole death as well...
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Post by Peter on Aug 28, 2023 21:03:39 GMT
The only requirements for a correct answer are that your character (YOU) is killed due to the event/circumstances/action described in each question.
I should have said, the same eligible book list as Sylas used last time.
And I have to confess that I have only limited access to the books this week, so if you are unsure if an answer is acceptable, I suggest you have a backup answer ready, in case I give you negative feedback at short notice.
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Aug 29, 2023 2:25:43 GMT
And I have to confess that I have only limited access to the books this week, so if you are unsure if an answer is acceptable, I suggest you have a backup answer ready, in case I give you negative feedback at short notice. How short though? Backup answers do no good if the player isn't online to read the feedback. A 24-hour grace period at the minimum to account for time zone differences would be fair, surely?
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Post by Peter on Aug 29, 2023 5:19:57 GMT
And I have to confess that I have only limited access to the books this week, so if you are unsure if an answer is acceptable, I suggest you have a backup answer ready, in case I give you negative feedback at short notice. How short though? Backup answers do no good if the player isn't online to read the feedback. A 24-hour grace period at the minimum to account for time zone differences would be fair, surely? I will be reasonable. If I tell you an answer is unacceptable, I will wait for a reply. 24 hrs minimum, but I think 48 hrs is enough. If you will be out of contact around the deadline, I will be gracious and allow more time. I have reviewed some entries today and I will continue to try to do so during the week.
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Post by Peter on Aug 29, 2023 5:43:15 GMT
Answers received from petch, gabe fandango, vastariner, sylas and greenspine.
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Post by Peter on Sept 2, 2023 21:29:14 GMT
Answers received from evilwizard. That makes at least six.
One more day for those who have not submitted.
All the answers I currently have are acceptable, but everyone can feel free to review their submissions and change anything they're not happy with.
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Post by Peter on Sept 4, 2023 3:51:38 GMT
Answers received from trialmaster and hallucination. I will check everything tomorrow.
Stand by.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,472
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Sept 4, 2023 8:17:54 GMT
Apologies I missed this one, foolishly didn't take note of the deadline. Be interesting to see the results.
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Sept 4, 2023 8:52:45 GMT
Question 7 is one that I'm most curious about. I really can't recall many instances where the PC specifically dies of thirst. There's no lack of answers for most of the others, but either my memory is failing me here, or there appears to be a fairly big risk of pile-ups here.
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Post by evilwizard on Sept 4, 2023 10:51:45 GMT
Question 7 is one that I'm most curious about. I really can't recall many instances where the PC specifically dies of thirst. There's no lack of answers for most of the others, but either my memory is failing me here, or there appears to be a fairly big risk of pile-ups here. I could only think of two, and my first wasn't accepted
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Post by a moderator on Sept 4, 2023 13:27:47 GMT
Question 7 is one that I'm most curious about. I really can't recall many instances where the PC specifically dies of thirst. There's no lack of answers for most of the others, but either my memory is failing me here, or there appears to be a fairly big risk of pile-ups here. I was also concerned about that one, and my researches after obtaining a little clarification failed to turn up more than the one answer I had already found. I shall be interested to see what I missed.
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Sept 4, 2023 15:08:25 GMT
I could only think of two, and my first wasn't accepted I was also concerned about that one, and my researches after obtaining a little clarification failed to turn up more than the one answer I had already found. I shall be interested to see what I missed. Same here. I wasn't even 100% certain about the answer I submitted (although it wasn't rejected), and can't really think of any other. Well, there was one other, but the wording makes it even more dubious than what I submitted. I can't believe there will come a day when I'd find myself digging through 2 of Livingstone's books through all the references for insta-fail sections just because I remember they both feature water-finding magic/item (and no, I couldn't appropriate answers in either of them), but that was what happened.
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Post by CharlesX on Sept 4, 2023 15:37:43 GMT
I was heavily deterred from entering because although this was a well-written round, the questions all seemed to require a reference; I don't have that many FF books to hand, and I don't think this is particularly elegant, either.
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Post by schlendrian on Sept 4, 2023 16:05:50 GMT
Would being lured to death by a Siren count as "dying of thirst" ?
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Post by CharlesX on Sept 4, 2023 16:14:43 GMT
Would being lured to death by a Siren count as "dying of thirst" ? Haha perhaps you mean like Katarina Heydrich in Vault Of The Vampire - I don't remember whether her beauty was just an illusion but she did a thing or two to teenage me.
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Post by Peter on Sept 5, 2023 3:52:16 GMT
Answers:
8 entries, plus my wife, who I decided to exclude, as I have probably dropped clues during the week and possibly given her an unfair advantage
Nobody died twice in the same book, except for an unusual circumstance – see later.
Q1. Dying by drowning
Curse of the Mummy, 353 - 1 (petch) Demons of the Deep, 392 - 1 (Gabe Fandango) Demons of the Deep, 369 - 1 (hallucination) Masks of Mayhem, 197 - 1 (sylas) Island of the Undead, 225 - 1 (vastariner) Starship Traveller, 288 - 1 (greenspine) Spectral Stalkers, 84 - 1 (evilwizard) Phantoms of Fear, 161 - 1 (trialmaster)
8 unique answers to start with. Falling into a river, being dragged or held underwater, and having your magically-created gills disappear, are all among the many available deaths chosen by participants.
Luckily for greenspine I am not accepting my wife's entry, or he would have had a double-up.
Q2. Dying by fire
Phantoms of Fear, 212 - 2 (Gabe Fandango, evilwizard) Gates of Death, 429 - 2 (sylas, trialmaster) Rebel Planet, 53 - 1 (petch) Masks of Mayhem, 191 - 1 (vastariner) Spellbreaker, 329 - 1 (greenspine) Midnight Rogue, 296 - 1 (hallucination)
Some went for natural fire, some went for magic spells. Gabe Fandango and evilwizard got caught out here, as did sylas and trialmaster, while all the others were unique. Petch correctly identified that the question asked for "dying by fire", not burning to death, so his choice to be trapped within a ring of flames and die by smoke inhalation, meets the criteria. Being pierced by "jets of liquid flame" from the wife of a powerful sorceror (in The Citadel of Chaos) was the option chosen by my wife. Should I be worried?
Scores after 2:
1st: 2 - petch, vastariner, greenspine, hallucination 5th: 3 - Gabe Fandango, sylas, evilwizard, trialmaster
That will have to do for now, as I have been called away. More later.
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Post by adrius on Sept 5, 2023 6:07:33 GMT
Apologies I missed this one, foolishly didn't take note of the deadline. Be interesting to see the results.
Oh dang, missed this round too (apologies Peter) but it seems to be another themed round and (interestingly) quite similar to mine a few rounds back Let's see how well everyone does this time!
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Post by Peter on Sept 6, 2023 0:28:15 GMT
Let's recap:
Q1. Dying by drowning
Unconscious in a fast-flowing river (Curse of the Mummy, 353) - 1 (petch) Your gills vanish, to the ogre's surprise, but he eats you anyway (Demons of the Deep, 392) - 1 (Gabe Fandango) You gasp and choke as the spell wears off (Demons of the Deep, 369) - 1 (hallucination) Held underwater by a watersnake (Masks of Mayhem, 197) - 1 (sylas) Dragged down by a legion of severed limbs (Island of the Undead, 225) - 1 (vastariner) You fall into the ocean as you materialise (Starship Traveller, 288) - 1 (greenspine) With bursting lungs, you breathe in cold sea water (Spectral Stalkers, 84) - 1 (evilwizard) You drown and get eaten by fish (Phantoms of Fear, 161) - 1 (trialmaster)
Q2: Dying by fire
Blasted into oblivion by a fireball (Phantoms of Fear, 212) - 2 (Gabe Fandango, evilwizard) Burned by magic fire (Gates of Death, 429) - 2 (sylas, trialmaster) Asphyxiated in a circle of burning bushes (Rebel Planet, 53) - 1 (petch) Suffer the agony of fire consuming your body (Masks of Mayhem, 191) - 1 (vastariner) Plunge into a raging inferno (Spellbreaker, 329) - 1 (greenspine) Plummet in a burning web (Midnight Rogue, 296) - 1 (hallucination)
On to the more difficult ones...
Q3: Dying by freezing
Frozen in a block of solidified mist (Deathmoor, 184) - 5 (Gabe Fandango, sylas, greenspine, evilwizard, trialmaster) Chilled by an ice ghost (Crypt of the Sorcerer, 357) - 2 (petch, vastariner) Caught in the open on a freezing night (Rebel Planet) - 1 (hallucination)
A much tighter question. Everyone split between 2 situations, until hallucination's last-minute entry, the only unique answer. The text makes it clear that you will freeze to death here. Good spotting.
Scores after 3 questions:
1st: 3 - hallucination 2nd: 4 - petch, vastariner 4th: 7 - greenspine 5th: 8 - Gabe Fandango, sylas, evilwizard, trialmaster
Big movement in the leaderboard.
Q4: Dying by being shot
Hit by a volley of elven arrows (Siege of Sardath, 204): 2 - Gabe Fandango, vastariner A crossbow bolt thuds into your chest (Spellbreaker, 178): 1 - petch Shot by an elven arrow (Secrets of Salomonis, 359): 1 - sylas An arrow pierces your neck (Crypt of the Sorcerer, 270): 1 - greenspine Hit by many dark elven arrows (Siege of Sardath, 26): 1 - evilwizard Blasted to atoms at point-blank range (Space Assassin, 333): 1 - trialmaster Hit by a hail of arrows (Deathtrap Dungeon, 219): 1 - hallucination
Everybody but trialmaster chose arrows or crossbow bolts, and most of those chose elves to be the shooters. Unlucky for Gabe Fandango and vastariner, the only double-up.
In Siege of Sardath, even though it doesn't state whether the arrows or the fall kills you, it does say that many arrows hit you, so it is sensible to assume you die before you hit the ground.
After the discussion about black holes, I realised that any phaser combat in Starship Traveller would meet the requirements, as you are killed instantly, regardless of your current stamina. Nobody took this option, however. Did nobody think of it, or were you all worried that it would be an unacceptable answer?
Scores after 4 questions:
1st: 4 - hallucination 2nd: 5 - petch 3rd: 6 - vastariner 4th: 8 - greenspine 5th: 9 - sylas, evilwizard, trialmaster 6th: 10 - Gabe Fandango
So the leaderboard is starting to spread out. Still anybody's game though. Warning: Q5 is another tight question, causing more movement on the board. Check in later to find out more...
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Post by Peter on Sept 6, 2023 9:52:05 GMT
Apologies I missed this one, foolishly didn't take note of the deadline. Be interesting to see the results.
Oh dang, missed this round too (apologies Peter) but it seems to be another themed round and (interestingly) quite similar to mine a few rounds back Let's see how well everyone does this time! One of the reasons I shelved this quiz initially. But when sylas revived the thread I decided to give it a go. And if some people were referring to the answers from your quiz, that just ramps up the uniqueness gamble.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,680
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Sept 6, 2023 15:03:51 GMT
For Q3 were there any other answers available? I had a rough time with some of these.
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Post by a moderator on Sept 6, 2023 17:23:10 GMT
I don't know if Rebel Planet 325 (feet frozen by liquid helium, snapping off at the ankles when you fall over) would count. I considered but, alas, didn't go with Daggers of Darkness 316 ('suffocated and frozen').
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Sept 6, 2023 22:06:24 GMT
For Q3 were there any other answers available? I had a rough time with some of these. Just off the top of my head, Agglax's frost breath in Armies of Death (should have gone with that). I think there are others, but can't confirm without checking the books.
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,680
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Sept 6, 2023 22:26:54 GMT
For Q3 were there any other answers available? I had a rough time with some of these. Just off the top of my head, Agglax's frost breath in Armies of Death (should have gone with that). I think there are others, but can't confirm without checking the books. That was actually my first thought but I figured more people would remember that.
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Post by Peter on Sept 7, 2023 1:05:26 GMT
Sorry for dragging this out. I tried to post this earlier. Anyway, the conclusion:
Q5: Dying by ingesting poison
Given a poisoned drink (Revenge of the Vampire, 90): 4 - hallucination, vastariner, evilwizard, Gabe Fandango Drinking cyanide (Blood of the Zombies, 376): 2 - sylas, trialmaster Eating poisoned mushrooms (The Port of Peril, 285): 1 - petch Eating and drinking poisoned cheese and wine (House of Hell, 172): 1 - greenspine
Unlucky again for Gabe Fandango and vastariner, and also evilwizard and hallucination. Some inadvertently chose something poisonous to consume, others were offered it by a deceitful host.
Scores after 5 questions:
1st: 6 – petch 2nd: 8 – hallucination 3rd: 9 – greenspine 4th: 10 – vastariner 5th: 11 – sylas, trialmaster 7th: 13 – evilwizard 8th: 14 – Gabe Fandango
Another big change on the leaderboard.
Q6: Dying by electrocution
Suffering repeated bolts of electricity (Eye of the Dragon, 38): 2 – vastariner, evilwizard Fried by a bolt of lightning due to a miscalculation (Spectral Stalkers, 98 & 221): 2 – greenspine, trialmaster Blasted into oblivion by a thunderbolt (Phantoms of Fear, 367): 1 – petch A massive lightning bolt crashes into you (Stealer of Souls, 341): 1 – Gabe Fandango Struck by lightning while holding a sword (Shadow of the Giants, 234): 1 – sylas Fried by sheets of lightning (The Rings of Kether, 224): 1 – hallucination
Many options again. Most people chose lightning, which I interpreted as a form of electricity. Petch experienced a "thunderbolt" in Phantoms of Fear, but it is described as a lightning bolt would be, so I decided it met the criteria.
However, for greenspine's and trialmaster's answers, while they got shocked on different steps, it is the same electrified staircase, and they have both miscalculated where the safe steps are, so this is really the same death for both of them.
Scores after 6 questions:
1st: 7 – petch 2nd: 9 – hallucination 3rd: 11 – greenspine 4th: 12 – vastariner, sylas 6th: 13 – trialmaster 7th: 15 – evilwizard, Gabe Fandango
Q7: Dying of thirst
The only truly unacceptable answer was tried here, with your car "dying of thirst" in Freeway Fighter. I gave out a few hints, but then decided to let people read the question and choose what they will.
Staked out for hours, into days (Battleblade Warrior, 72): 3 – petch, greenspine, vastariner A skeleton holds your hand until you become one yourself (Seas of Blood, 11): 2 – sylas, trialmaster Succumbing to heat because you didn't drink a liquid (Deathtrap Dungeon, 366): 1 – Gabe Fandango Struggling in the hot desert (Temple of Terror, 84): 1 – evilwizard Delerious then in a coma after 3 days (Talisman of Death): 1 – hallucination
Looking closer, Gabe's death in Deathtrap Dungeon is about heat, not thirst, and the liquid in the bamboo pipe is magical rather than simply refreshing. So his death is from heat exhaustion, not thirst. And evilwizard only loses 4 stamina points in Temple of Terror, rather than dying outright. So maximum points for those two, I'm afraid.
Scores after 7 questions:
1st: 10 – petch, hallucination 3rd: 14 – greenspine, sylas 5th: 15 – vastariner, trialmaster 7th: 23 – evilwizard, Gabe Fandango
Petch and hallucination have opened up a gap over the rest.
Q8: Dying of hunger
Starving in a cell (Beneath Nightmare Castle, 340): 3 – greenspine, trialmaster, hallucination A skeleton holds your hand until you become one yourself (Seas of Blood, 11): 1 – petch Lost in a maze (Midnight Rogue, 370): 1 – Gabe Fandango Feeling the dull ache of hunger growing (Slaves of the Abyss, 355): 1 – sylas Suspended in a cage until your stamina runs out (House of Hell, 396): 1 – vastariner Contemplating death by starvation (Crypt of the Sorceror): 1 – evilwizard
Petch chose the same death in Seas of Blood as sylas chose for the previous question. This says that you die from "hunger and thirst", making it a unique answer twice. I have to allow this.
Several options here, resulting in 6 different deaths. They were all unique until trialmaster's and hallucination's last-minute entries, which spoiled things for greenspine (and themselves).
My wife found a reference in The Forest of Doom where you need to eat 5 provisions while recovering from a broken leg, or else you die of starvation. No stamina loss mentioned, just "use up 5 provisions or starve". A clever answer missed by everyone else.
Scores after 8 questions:
1st: 11 – petch 2nd: 13 - hallucination 3rd: 15 – sylas 4th: 16 - vastariner 5th: 17 – greenspine 6th: 18 – trialmaster 7th: 24 – evilwizard, Gabe Fandango
Q9: Dying by falling
You roll over the edge of a precipice (Vault of the Vampire, 370): 2 – evilwizard, trialmaster You fall for an eternity (Sky Lord, 38): 1 – petch You tumble, whirling and screaming (Black Vein Prophecy, 230): 1 – Gabe Fandango The floor gives way beneath you (Bloodbones, 272): 1 – sylas Hags cackle as you plummet (Spellbreaker, 93): 1 – vastariner You fall down a cliff, bouncing off rocks (Talisman of Death, 263): 1 – greenspine You are dropped from a flying carpet (Scorpion Swamp, 297): 1 – hallucination
Many options available again, and only one double-up. Greenspine correctly pointed out that although he is resurrected after dying in Talisman of Death, he still dies.
Similar to Q4, any one strike combat in Chasms of Malice would have been accepted, as you die immediately rather than simply losing stamina. But again, nobody chose this option.
Scores with one to go:
1st: 12 – petch 2nd: 14 – hallucination 3rd: 16 – sylas 4th: 17 – vastariner 5th: 18 – greenspine 6th: 20 – trialmaster 7th: 25 – Gabe Fandango 8th: 26 – evilwizard
Q10: Dying by being buried
Trapped in a chamber filling with sand (Curse of the Mummy, 42 & 179): 2 – vastariner, evilwizard Your chair sinks into the earth (Moonrunner, 81): 1 – Gabe Fandango Buried under a collapsing temple (Knights of Doom, 364): 1 – trialmaster Entombed in an ancient necropolis (Curse of the Mummy, 285): 1 – greenspine A grandstand collapses on you (Appointment with FEAR, 384): 1 – sylas Buried under a collapsing tower (Spellbreaker, 336): 1 – hallucination Swept off a mountain by an avalanche (Tower of Destruction, 203): 1 – petch
Burial in sand was the most popular death here, followed by burial under collapsing buildings.
Vastariner's and evilwizard's deaths, while on different references, refer to the same situation, so this is a double-up. Greenspine's death, on the other hand, is a different event in a different place, so this is a unique answer.
Although petch was swept off a mountain by an avalanche, the reference in Tower of Destruction specifically states "crushed to death" on the rocks below, so burial in the avalanche is the cause of death.
Final scoreboard:
1st: 13 – petch 2nd: 15 – hallucination 3rd: 17 – sylas 4th: 19 – vastariner, greenspine 6th: 21 – trialmaster 7th: 26 – Gabe Fandango 8th: 28 – evilwizard
Too many options in the last 2 questions, so no chance for anyone to catch the leaders. Petch pushed the limits of some of the definitions, but cleverly stayed within them, to take 1st place. With the same number of unique deaths (8), hallucination takes 2nd. Congratulations on dying the most differently.
If I had included my wife's answers, she would have done quite well and finished 3rd. Her only other influence on the leaderboard would have been to push greenspine down a place, due to double-ups. Among the unique deaths she found were being zapped by the Warlock's chest in Firetop Mountain, jumping from the wall of the City of Thieves and breaking her neck, and sinking into quicksand on the Island of the Lizard King.
Well done to all the participants. There was quite a breadth of knowledge displayed. Had you made a start on any of the questions, kieran and adrius? How would you have compared?
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Sept 7, 2023 1:57:30 GMT
Looking closer, Gabe's death in Deathtrap Dungeon is about heat, not thirst, and the liquid in the bamboo pipe is magical rather than simply refreshing. So his death is from heat exhaustion, not thirst. And evilwizard only loses 4 stamina points in Temple of Terror, rather than dying outright. So maximum points for those two, I'm afraid. Sorry, but what did you mean previously when you mentioned that all the answers you received had been acceptable? I'd assumed that my answer had qualified then. Not complaining about my scoring, because the only other potential answer I found is probably a bad one too, so I couldn't have given a good backup answer to make up anyway, just wish to clarify this.
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Post by hallucination on Sept 7, 2023 7:43:26 GMT
Congrats to petch and thanks to Peter!
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