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Post by scouserob on Jun 26, 2024 20:05:42 GMT
Congratulations to Adrius. π₯ (Should never have gone into those Hills π)
Thanks Petch. The two-fold Messenger of Death theme was great fun. πππ»
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Wildy
Squire
Posts: 40
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by Wildy on Jun 26, 2024 20:12:28 GMT
Indeed, an excellent game! Some were very tricky to find answers, and others were interesting to balance between various choices. Congrats to Adrius!
I canβt believe noone picked Hamelin(Scholastic map) or Sardath, those were my first choices before going for more obscure choices (come oooon! 3 people picked the same unnamed hill from a book with the dullest map!!!)
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sylas
Baron
"Don't just adventure for treasure; treasure the adventure!"
Posts: 1,731
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy, Way of the Tiger
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Post by sylas on Jun 26, 2024 20:24:41 GMT
Indeed, an excellent game! Some were very tricky to find answers, and others were interesting to balance between various choices. Congrats to Adrius! I canβt believe noone picked Hamelin(Scholastic map) or Sardath, those were my first choices before going for more obscure choices (come oooon! 3 people picked the same unnamed hill from a book with the dullest map!!!) Probably thought they were easy answers and reverse-psyched themselves out of it. I know I did for a few, going for ones I thought no ones else would pick but did.
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Post by vastariner on Jun 26, 2024 20:58:59 GMT
Question 4: Name a code word you are instructed to take note of that begins with the letter TCorrect answers:Tiaohe ( Black Vein Prophecy): 3 (Wildy, Gabe Fandango, trialmaster) Anal(ander) point of order: tiaohe is not a code word, but a spell.
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Post by Per on Jun 26, 2024 21:16:49 GMT
Shared fifth place? I guess I'll take it - I had expected to be demolished on Q4 and Q9. Rings has lots of cool options for Q2, like Arcturian Vanque, Antarian Robot, Asteroid Defences and Androform - I guess that's why nobody took them. I'm surprised the vanilla Assassin got picked, though, since it must be in a handful of different books. Q4 was just darn difficult. I dismissed Prophecy as a source of codewords after seeing that it calls most words "names" or "spells" and/or doesn't tell you to note them down. But apparently this is inconsistent, as for instance 397 clearly labels Biantai a codeword to be written down, and 118 at least calls Tiaohe a "word". Sorcery was also a little tricky since I think only the auxiliary Spell Book calls them "code words", the books themselves just call them "codes". The three way clash of 'Hills' from The Forest of Doom proved crucial. Perhaps it is so invitingly inconspicuous that players were drawn to it (indeed, Per noted in his submission that it was an answer that he considered and rejected on the grounds that it might be too obviously clever). Even so, going with "Marsh", "Path" or "Forest Path" would have saved me a point on Q10, all else being the same. Thanks to petch for the contest and congratulations to adrius for winning. It was fun fishing out obscure answers for the questions with lots of options, while knowing that some random clashes are bound to occur anyway (GABE THIRD KAPPA WHAT WERE YOU THINKING). Also! I've prepared questions for a light, casual, single-book summer contest, in case people want to keep this going more or less seamlessly and nobody else is chomping at the bit to present their own set.
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Wildy
Squire
Posts: 40
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by Wildy on Jun 26, 2024 21:28:10 GMT
Question 4:Β Name a code word you are instructed to take note of that begins with the letter TCorrect answers:Tiaohe ( Black Vein Prophecy): 3 (Wildy, Gabe Fandango, trialmaster) Anal(ander) point of order: tiaohe is not a code word, but a spell. After searching for 5 hours, I was looking and making sure the text clearly indicates that itβs a code (and normally need to write down in your adventure sheet), regardless of what it means on its own. It may be a bit of a stretch compared to other options where it was clearly stated to βmark it downβ, but it is a code word. Like what would use two spies: βI hear the Tiaohe is quite blooming at this time of year?β βTiaohe!β Turning to page 47 of their spy guide.
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Post by petch on Jun 26, 2024 22:13:05 GMT
Yeah, that one was a tough adjudication, but as Per said, BVP does refer to its powers as 'codewords' in at least two references (280 and 397, and there may be more), and so for that reason I was happy to take 'tiaohe' as an answer - plus it was already such a tough question (sorry!) I didn't want to limit possible answers even further by being overly harsh.
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Post by hallucination on Jun 26, 2024 22:59:00 GMT
Thanks petch, that was a fantastic round! Congratulations Adrius
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Post by vastariner on Jun 26, 2024 23:25:31 GMT
Yeah, that one was a tough adjudication, but as Per said, BVP does refer to its powers as 'codewords' in at least two references (280 and 397, and there may be more), and so for that reason I was happy to take 'tiaohe' as an answer - plus it was already such a tough question (sorry!) I didn't want to limit possible answers even further by being overly harsh. It was a clever bit of writing that it was not always "which spell do you wish to use" - each spell had its own characteristic verb (summon Izhkao, name shangsuo). But they are called spells or powers in the book; to me they are not "code" words (i.e. shorthand for "have you done this/do you have this titbit of info?"), but akin to possessions.
ETA: the use of "codeword" in the text is also clever - they both come early in the adventure, while you do not know what you have. When you get your third (baopo/shangsuo), the vocabulary shifts to powers, as Maior realises that he is an innate magic-user rather than being a Yaztromo customer.
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Post by adrius on Jun 27, 2024 0:06:26 GMT
The three way clash of 'Hills' from The Forest of Doom proved crucial. Perhaps it is so invitingly inconspicuous that players were drawn to it (indeed, Per noted in his submission that it was an answer that he considered and rejected on the grounds that it might be too obviously clever). Whatever the reason, the prior leader scouserob being caught up in the clash allowed adrius to reclaim the advantage and clinch the win by the narrowest of margins. So congrats to adrius, and commiserations once again to Wildy whose run of rotten luck continued as he ended up at the back of the pack yet again (albeit joined this time by vastariner). Thanks to all for participating, hope you enjoyed. Quite surprised to have done well this time. My initial reaction to this quiz was to look into the later (>#50) gamebooks due to the need for codewords, and ended up challenging myself to pick one answer from each of the gamebooks numbered #50 to #59, which amazingly worked. Once again, thanks to petch for hosting an interestingly themed round, and to everyone for the varied answers that brought thrill to the competition. Based on the previous indexed tabulation here (if Per, kieran or anyone else might be interested to add it to the first page to help future quizmasters?) -- this seems to conclude 27 rounds of the quiz, so the next one would then be the 28th, for anyone still keen on keeping count. Also curious as to whether picking "twenty-seven" from Creature of Havoc r325 (the "codeword/number" to one of the pickable plants from Bu Fon Fen) would have counted for Q4?
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Post by Gabe Fandango on Jun 27, 2024 1:48:26 GMT
I submitted a backup answer for Q4, since I, too, wasn't completely sure if Tiaohe qualifies as a codeword myself (although that answer would have gotten me the exact same points, since I chose 'turn'). Ouch, I think that might have set a record for the most incorrect answers submitted during a single round. I don't if this was true, but if it was, then you, sir, just set a new record this round! while knowing that some random clashes are bound to occur anyway (GABE THIRD KAPPA WHAT WERE YOU THINKING). Hey, if it weren't for this clash, I'd have been a co-winner this round! I'm the one who should be complaining!
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,534
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jun 27, 2024 6:55:55 GMT
Based on the previous indexed tabulation here (if Per, kieran or anyone else might be interested to add it to the first page to help future quizmasters?) Good idea. Have added the list to the first post.
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Post by Peter on Jun 27, 2024 7:31:05 GMT
Thank you Petch. Well done everybody. Good tactics Adrius.
I still think "The Analander" should be allowed. You are instructed to note it down, and it is only when someone uses the exact phrase that you respond, not "when someone identifies you as an Analander" or "when you are recognised". I see it as a codeword. Or "The" is one of the two codewords.
I guess I could have chosen TEL.
My wife's annoyed - she would have tied with me if she hadn't messed up Q9.
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Post by petch on Jun 27, 2024 8:52:03 GMT
Also curious as to whether picking "twenty-seven" from Creature of Havoc r325 (the "codeword/number" to one of the pickable plants from Bu Fon Fen) would have counted for Q4? I actually made a concerted effort to set questions that were as unambiguous as possible in an attempt to prevent controversy, but clearly unsuccessfully since as some of the posts above argue, what constitutes a code word can be open to interpretation. The rule of thumb I eventually settled on was that a word had to be referred to as a 'code' or 'codeword' by the text, or prefaced by an instruction similar to 'note down the word...' As that example doesn't do either of the above, I would most likely have ruled that this wouldn't have counted as a code word.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,534
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jun 27, 2024 8:53:20 GMT
My wife's annoyed - she would have tied with me if she hadn't messed up Q9. I had a query about that ruling actually. Isn't naming the book/reference number a way for the quizmaster to verify an answer rather than the answer itself? So she wasn't exactly incorrect.
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Post by petch on Jun 27, 2024 8:54:21 GMT
Ouch, I think that might have set a record for the most incorrect answers submitted during a single round. I don't if this was true, but if it was, then you, sir, just set a new record this round! Ha, seems like I was a much harsher quizmaster than I intended to be!
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Post by petch on Jun 27, 2024 9:02:34 GMT
My wife's annoyed - she would have tied with me if she hadn't messed up Q9. I had a query about that ruling actually. Isn't naming the book/reference number a way for the quizmaster to verify an answer rather than the answer itself? So she wasn't exactly incorrect. That's true to be fair. On the one hand, I wasn't able to verify the answer from the information supplied, and it was only because I remembered Hope's End from Moonrunner that I could establish that it was an actual location on a map. But on the other hand, the answer itself does answer the question correctly. On balance, okay I'll concede this one - Peter you can let your wife know she can have the tie with yourself
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Post by vastariner on Jun 27, 2024 9:49:54 GMT
Peter you can let your wife know she can have the tie with yourself Isn't that rather a personal matter?
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Post by Per on Jun 27, 2024 11:38:47 GMT
Based on the previous indexed tabulation here (if Per, kieran or anyone else might be interested to add it to the first page to help future quizmasters?) Good idea. Have added the list to the first post. That means either you'll have to update the list from now on, or you'll have to re-grab my list periodically if I do, since the quote won't update dynamically.
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,534
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jun 27, 2024 11:52:15 GMT
Good idea. Have added the list to the first post. That means either you'll have to update the list from now on, or you'll have to re-grab my list periodically if I do, since the quote won't update dynamically. Yep, I'll update as needs be.
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Post by adrius on Jun 27, 2024 12:58:53 GMT
That means either you'll have to update the list from now on, or you'll have to re-grab my list periodically if I do, since the quote won't update dynamically. Yep, I'll update as needs be. Thanks for the initiative. Would it be also possible to (hope this wouldn't be too much trouble):
- Put the list in a spoiler-like dropdown, so it wouldn't clutter the page, but readers that want to navigate the list can still open it
- Number the list
- Append a round's theme on the description (if any)?
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kieran
Baron
Posts: 2,534
Favourite Gamebook Series: Fighting Fantasy
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Post by kieran on Jun 27, 2024 13:48:21 GMT
Yep, I'll update as needs be. Thanks for the initiative. Would it be also possible to (hope this wouldn't be too much trouble):
- Put the list in a spoiler-like dropdown, so it wouldn't clutter the page, but readers that want to navigate the list can still open it
- Number the list
- Append a round's theme on the description (if any)?
Done
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Post by Per on Jun 27, 2024 20:21:19 GMT
And then there's this old geezer: "Hrm! Clearly this rare edition of Out of the Pit appears to have accidentally fallen open on the spread with the She-Satyr entry."It is summer (on this half of Titan, anyway), and to escape the stuffy heat of the cities we've journeyed to the lush countryside. What shall we find as we stroll down the sun-dappled paths and verdant glens of... let's check the map, what's this that's been scribbled across the top again... The Forest of Doom, by Ian Livingstone? Let us first get our bearings in this forested realm.1. Identify a named location or character. Of the perks of civilization lost to these backwoods, circulation of coin does not seem to be one.2. Identify an occasion on which you can expend one or more Gold Pieces in order to obtain some item or service, seek some favour, or comply with some threat or obligation. I've already worked up the appetite to tuck into anything.3. Identify something you get to eat. Phew, I'm sure glad I had that wotzit in my pack!4. Identify an occasion on which you can repel or incapacitate an enemy using an item, excluding your sword. Let us cross over the river and rest under the shade of the trees.5. Identify a method by which you may pass either of the river branches flowing through and past the forest. But who actually goes around affixing the price tags?6. Identify an item you can find with a stated value in Gold Pieces, excluding individual Gold Pieces. I feel like I'm climbing up and down all the time.7. Identify a location you can visit above or below ground level. Stop ganging up on me!8. Identify a type of enemy that can be fought (with listed Skill and Stamina) in multiples on one pass through the forest. A wotzit? Hold on, I should have one in here somewhere...9. Identify an item you can find in the forest and then be asked if you possess, excluding tower-bought items and Gold Pieces. I'm just about ready for it to be over now.10. Identify a way for the adventure to end, excluding loss of Stamina.
Rules beyond the you-know-the-drill: * The scope of the round is only FF3: The Forest of Doom, as originally published by Puffin. Any copy from other publishers should suffice to derive proper answers, but watch out that you don't rely on any added material or weird foreign misprints. * Answers to be PM'd to me by midnight BST on the 4th of July, giving just a little over a week. * The penalty used for wrong answers will be the complicated square-root-of-pi-to-the-power-of-the-stock-market-index magical formula. Optimal strategy: don't submit wrong answers! * No backup answers. Requests for clarification that would suggest one or more answers should be directed to me by PM, after which I will likely decline to provide a public statement which would suggest one or more answers. Again, just don't submit any wrong answers and all will be fine! * In case there is a tie for first place, it will be broken in favour of the contestant with the highest combined value in Gold Pieces in their answers to questions 2 and 6. For question 6, it will simply be the stated value. For question 2, if there are variable or multiple possible transactions, the value used will be the highest possible defined amount of a single transaction. If somehow it gets more convoluted than that, I will decide on something and that cannot be appealed. Good luck!
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Post by evilwizard on Jun 27, 2024 20:59:59 GMT
I was very pleased with my answers for Q1, Q6 and especially Q10 as I thought it might be disallowed for not mentioning it by name in the text - less so with Q4, Q8 and Q9 where I just submitted the first answer I could remember and find the reference number for instead of trying to think of / find alternatives.
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Post by Peter on Jun 28, 2024 9:13:52 GMT
I had a query about that ruling actually. Isn't naming the book/reference number a way for the quizmaster to verify an answer rather than the answer itself? So she wasn't exactly incorrect. That's true to be fair. On the one hand, I wasn't able to verify the answer from the information supplied, and it was only because I remembered Hope's End from Moonrunner that I could establish that it was an actual location on a map. But on the other hand, the answer itself does answer the question correctly. On balance, okay I'll concede this one - Peter you can let your wife know she can have the tie with yourself Thanks Petch. And Kieran. But now I'm annoyed - I haven't done better than her for several quizzes now.
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Post by Per on Jun 28, 2024 15:40:11 GMT
Gabe Fandango, hallucination, petch and kieran have already bravely entered the forest!
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Post by Per on Jun 30, 2024 18:06:39 GMT
Wildy, trialmaster, evilwizard, vastariner and sylas have disappeared in among the trees!
I want to present a clarification for question 6 ("Identify an item you can find with a stated value in Gold Pieces, excluding individual Gold Pieces."). Consider the distinction between
A. Some party making an offer, request or similar, the specifics of which can be construed as a direct or indirect statement of valuation on their part, and
B. The book itself telling you something about an item while presenting it, which must be assumed to be universally valid.
While I admit that the question as phrased doesn't properly rule out all instances of A, the intent is for it to only cover B. So anyone who has submitted an answer falling under A, please accept my apologies and submit a backup replacement answer for the question.
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Post by vastariner on Jul 1, 2024 23:19:42 GMT
The quiz made me think about the first few books, and living through them back in the day before you knew there was an Allansia tying them all in.
It's as if Steve 'n' Ian sat down and thought of scenarios for the books, and picked one each to write:
Cave Castle Forest Space City Competition Jungle Ice Horror Dystopia Desert
Throw in guest authors dealing with Swamp, Ship, and Undersea, and you've got most big genres covered...about the only thing left was Mountain which really has never properly been covered (unless you count Ice), and that's probably because the enemy in that is the Mountain itself, it doesn't lend itself to much of a scenario other than avoiding falling off.
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Post by Per on Jul 2, 2024 15:01:10 GMT
adrius, Peter and Peter's wife have been spotted strolling in the woods! A little over two more days to go.
There is (at least) one more question that may have been open to unintended interpretations. So for Q7 ("Identify a location you can visit above or below ground level."), consider the following:
1. "Above or below ground" should not be construed as covering any case where you're not literally wedged into the ground, and
2. There is no default ground level (as we don't know the exact topography of the whole forest anyway); there should be some notable amount of vertical displacement relative to the surrounding ground level.
If in light of this you think your answer might not count, feel free to provide a replacement.
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Post by vastariner on Jul 2, 2024 17:08:29 GMT
So "above ground level" means it's not on the ground floor?
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